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How much should 5e aim at balance?
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<blockquote data-quote="Tony Vargas" data-source="post: 5985395" data-attributes="member: 996"><p>Strange, I'd think 3e came pretty close to what you wanted. You advance mostly as wizard, but get a level of fighter at some point, maybe a second one at a future date. It's strictly dilutive - nothing you get from that fighter level is worth the lost caster level, let alone getting your next spell level a level later - but that's clearly not the point. <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f609.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=";)" title="Wink ;)" data-smilie="2"data-shortname=";)" /></p><p></p><p>Funny thing is, I used a variant that worked something like that in my long AD&D campaign (which spanned the 1e/2e rev-roll). I let a player choose a 'secondary class' for a 10% experience penalty (or a 'special skill' or 'special ability' were also options for the exp penalty). The secondary class would advance to half the level of the primary, rounded down, working, mechanically, like just like a character with two classes, who had advanced to that level in the secondary class before switching to the secondary. It meant your HD changed as you leveled, for instance, so it was a little messy. The actual experience cost for advancing the secondary class was pretty trivial. The rule was conceived for a campaign where everyone would play a 'Thief,' so that the other classes' critical abilities could still be present. </p><p></p><p>4e multi-classing works very differently, the primarily one class with a 'touch' of another is what it tends towards. So you could be a wizard who MCs Fighter, and once in a blue moon swaps a spell for an exploit, or even takes a fighter PP or ED (though I doubt that'd work out). My second 4e character was a very nostalgic-feeling "elven fighter/magic-user," an Eladrin Wizard McFighter Wizard of the Spiral Tower. The campaign world was a version of Harn that the DM had run on and off back to 2e, so each edition was rationalized as a jump forward in history with mystic cataclysms changing the way things worked. I RP'd the conceit that Varnihal had learned magic from an ancestors' AD&D-era spellbook. He was big on collecting rituals. It was a surprising amount of fun, considering that, in addition to 'gimping' myself by only picking classic spells (Lightning Bolt was, for instance, widely considered one of the worst early 4e spells, but I got a surprising amount of good use out of it), I also eschewed any spell the previous campaign's wizard had had, and she'd very carefully picked the 'best' ones. But, anyway, yes, he had the feel of a Wizard with just a bit of fighter, and, because everything advances at 1/2 level, he remained pretty decent with a sword (and good at Athletics, incidentally) throughout, so you had the sense that he was advancing in both all the time.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Tony Vargas, post: 5985395, member: 996"] Strange, I'd think 3e came pretty close to what you wanted. You advance mostly as wizard, but get a level of fighter at some point, maybe a second one at a future date. It's strictly dilutive - nothing you get from that fighter level is worth the lost caster level, let alone getting your next spell level a level later - but that's clearly not the point. ;) Funny thing is, I used a variant that worked something like that in my long AD&D campaign (which spanned the 1e/2e rev-roll). I let a player choose a 'secondary class' for a 10% experience penalty (or a 'special skill' or 'special ability' were also options for the exp penalty). The secondary class would advance to half the level of the primary, rounded down, working, mechanically, like just like a character with two classes, who had advanced to that level in the secondary class before switching to the secondary. It meant your HD changed as you leveled, for instance, so it was a little messy. The actual experience cost for advancing the secondary class was pretty trivial. The rule was conceived for a campaign where everyone would play a 'Thief,' so that the other classes' critical abilities could still be present. 4e multi-classing works very differently, the primarily one class with a 'touch' of another is what it tends towards. So you could be a wizard who MCs Fighter, and once in a blue moon swaps a spell for an exploit, or even takes a fighter PP or ED (though I doubt that'd work out). My second 4e character was a very nostalgic-feeling "elven fighter/magic-user," an Eladrin Wizard McFighter Wizard of the Spiral Tower. The campaign world was a version of Harn that the DM had run on and off back to 2e, so each edition was rationalized as a jump forward in history with mystic cataclysms changing the way things worked. I RP'd the conceit that Varnihal had learned magic from an ancestors' AD&D-era spellbook. He was big on collecting rituals. It was a surprising amount of fun, considering that, in addition to 'gimping' myself by only picking classic spells (Lightning Bolt was, for instance, widely considered one of the worst early 4e spells, but I got a surprising amount of good use out of it), I also eschewed any spell the previous campaign's wizard had had, and she'd very carefully picked the 'best' ones. But, anyway, yes, he had the feel of a Wizard with just a bit of fighter, and, because everything advances at 1/2 level, he remained pretty decent with a sword (and good at Athletics, incidentally) throughout, so you had the sense that he was advancing in both all the time. [/QUOTE]
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