Reply to thread

Message: <blockquote data-quote="Neonchameleon" data-source="post: 8332004" data-attributes="member: 87792">Hmmm... breaking the group downDiviner vs Transmuter. This one honestly has a minor difference. I mean a diviner is better than a transmuter basically by two lucky rolls in the right place. This might matter sometimes but is nothing compared to just being an 8th level wizard.Polearm Master vs PDK/Banneret isn't a direct contest. We need to break it in halves - featless greatsword fighter vs polearm master and PDK vs BattlemasterFor the weapon let's assume they both started with 16 STR and now have 20 STR. The PDK has a sword and +2 Con, the Polearm Master has ... a polearm and polearm master. Both have +1 weapons and the Armour Mastery fighting style (because I really can't be bothered with rerolls for DPR). The PDK gets 2 attacks/round averaging 13 damage/hit (26dpr assuming hits). The Polearm Master gets 2 attacks/round averaging 11.5 damage/hit plus 1 bonus action attack averaging 8.5 damage (31.5 drpr assuming hits). So the polearm master is doing about 20% more damage before before the extra polearm reaction attack on foes coming in (which more than counteracts the not getting the bonus attack with action surge). In exchange the fighter gets about 8 extra hit points which means ... not very much most of the time as you just need it healing. Then there's PDK vs Battlemaster. The PDK has a relevant ability, allowing healing up to 8 hit points per ally per short rest that doesn't work on downed allies - but it's normally going to be less than that if the PDK uses their second wind to heal themselves. The Battlemaster on the other hand has 5 superiority dice (all d8s). If they only use Precision Strike (not the best, just good and easy to analyse) and use it when  they think they'd miss by 1-4 on a d20 then they are using it one attack in 5. They also turn this into a hit by my reckoning only failing 3 times in 16 on average (remember there's a 100% chance of succeeding if you miss by 1 down to a 3/8 if you missed by 4. So that's 1/5 *13/16 times you get extra hits while your superiority dice last. Or about 1/6 extra hits as long as you have short rests every 25 attacks or so (roughly 7-8 rounds).If the battlemaster polearm master is doing 20% extra DPR (an underestimate due to the reaction attack) and is getting 1/6 attacks turned from a miss to a hit then they're going to do 40% extra DPR over the PDK.  Which is going to lead to snowballing advantages as enemies go down faster and the best way to prevent them hurting you is take them down (and massively outweigh the PDK's healing).Twilight Cleric vs War ClericThe War Cleric basically brings their spells, weapons, and heavy armour and shield to the party. How much better the twilight cleric is situational.<ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Darkvision can be redundant (everyone has it or you don't need it) or it can be pure gold for humans trying to stealth in the dark. If the war cleric were to try that they'd burn all their second level slots.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">There's a room in White Plume Mountain that's supposed to be climbing from chain and disk to chain and disk over a boiling geyser. A minute's worth of flight is not only enough to cross the room but to set up a basic rope system handing everyone advantage. There are I think a couple of other places where this is useful.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Renewing temporary hit points will allow the party to face-tank being boiled alive in a couple of places with limited harm.</li> </ul>So all else being equal the twilight cleric will give the party a significantly easier time - or lure them into thinking they're being clever. This in addition to really doing well in extended fights.Arcane Trickster vs PHB Beastmaster RangerThe Beastmaster has several problems, starting with the beast being more an escort mission than an ally. Made even worse with AoEs and damaging terrain.The rogue is obviously the better skill monkey; at level 8 they have expertise in four skills to the beastmaster's none - and one more skill plus thieves tools to two languages (from favoured enemy). Oh, and cunning action. Those rogue skills really do help - and a +11 stealth is seriously usefulThe problem with ranger spells is that the PHB ranger only gets five of them (plus Primal Awareness) at level 8. By comparison the Arcane Trickster has six plus Mage Hand and two other cantrips (Booming Blade and Minor Illusion being popular). And PHB ranger spells get used up fast; just about everyone is likely to want Hunter's Mark and Absorb Elements. Which leads to three spells left to really improve things, and at least one should be an offensive combat spell (Entangle, Silence for shutting down mages, Spike Growth being obvious). Which leaves not much space left over, however good Darkvision, Pass Without Trace, and Enhance Ability all are. (Darkvision of course is treading on the Twilight Cleric domain). Pass Without Trace is arguably an encounter-solver, letting a cleric stealth like a rogue.Meanwhile the Arcane Trickster has six spells known - and the rogue isn't expected to need combat spells. Find Familiar is arguably more useful than an animal companion - and doesn't have the cost for losing it. Silent Image is nice. Shadow Blade and Invisibility are great roguish spells, and Misty Step is great for escaping in an emergency.There are just a whole lot of things the rogue does a whole lot better. Including damage and they are one of the two lead damage dealers here.</blockquote>

Verification