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Message: <blockquote data-quote="FrankTrollman" data-source="post: 1149616" data-attributes="member: 14225">Yes, in the 3rd edition rules set Undead Temporary Hit Points seemed to last forever in all cases.If you were to call a class "balanced" you would want people to be able to walk away at any time. If you need to take all the levels of a class in order for it to be balanced you've essentially admitted that the early levels are overpowered and the late levels are underpowered. If all the levels are appropriately powered - it shouldn't be a problem for someone to take levels of another class at any time.The only rules in the entire game for death blows are the coup de grace rules. That's where you attempt to stick a weapon into a creature's heart (or whatever).It requires:1> The creature be helpless (vampires are not helpless even at zero hit points.2> The creature be subject to critical hits (vampires are immune to critical hits normally, and further are in gassesous form when at zero hit points and don't even have hearts - even in flavor text at that point).3> That you do damage to the prospective victim (vampires have DR and are in gasseous form - rendering them immune to the damage of practically any wooden stake).---So not only can you not target a vampire with a coup de grace (not helpless), it wouldn't work (not subject to critical hits), and even if you applied the rules to it anyway nothing would happen (DR).So no. There is no way to stake a vampire. Every single step of the process for stabbing people in the heart is thwarted by one of the vampire's many other abilities.I use a very much smaller Undead template which works OK and is LA +0.Now, if you are undead you get the following adjustments:* You don't heal normally.* You suffer penalties of some kind in sunlight (except at Noon).* You can't see people who are holding their breath.* You suffer damage slowly and continuously (1 point a day) from drainand/or decay.* Your Con goes away completely, and you get hit point modifiers by yourStrength (if corporeal) or Charisma (if incorporeal).* You become subject to wards against spirits and similar effects.* You no longer have to breathe or eat.* You no longer have an attached soul, and ignore spells and effects whichcause negative levels and many curses.* You suffer damage from normal healing effects, but are healed by negativeenergy.* Your strength goes up by 2 within 5 minutes of Noon and at night, you getthese bonuses whether or not the sun is literally visible.* Your strength goes down by 2 during the day (except at Noon), you getthese penalties whether or not the sun is literally visible.* You no longer have a death margin. At zero hit points, you are destroyed.With Vampires having the special ability to heal themselves up to their level/day by drinking blood (the kind lost from hit point damage rather than con loss or something fancy).Yes, I use Undead who are subject to critical hits and mind affect effects - it simply causes too many problems if vampires are immune to those things (as seen by their apparent immunity to being staked through the heart).Then, if people want to gain "vampire powers" they need to take prestige classes that I write for Undead to take.-Frank</blockquote>

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