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General Tabletop Discussion
Character Builds & Optimization
How to avoid ridiculous player character builds
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<blockquote data-quote="Jackinthegreen" data-source="post: 6155276" data-attributes="member: 6678119"><p>Restricting books and items and such is usually more of an excuse for saying "I can't be bothered to learn the rules for these things, so I'm just going to ban them." Now, saying you aren't going to learn a certain rules set isn't a bad thing necessarily since it can take considerable time and effort to do that you might not be able to put in. But there are definitely those DMs who do it out of laziness or ignorance of how great some of the non-core stuff is.</p><p></p><p>Some of the better ways to nip crazy stuff in the bud though:</p><p></p><p>1: Don't play with abusive players. If you know someone is going to try to break the game and make things difficult for everyone, don't invite them to play. Or if they do end up playing, see the rest of this list for ways on how to deal with them.</p><p></p><p>2: All players must be able to cite the sources for stuff that isn't well-known to the group (and even some well-known stuff should get a look at. I once played with a guy who thought rangers only got one Favored Enemy when they very clearly get 5 by level 20). This means actually being able to open the book, website, etc and show the DM the exact rules.</p><p></p><p>3: All players must be able to actually describe the rules for their character, and put in the effort to actually help the DM go through them if something seems off. If they can't be bothered to help the DM understand what's going on (and do so civilly too) then they need to act their act together. And definitely make sure you have the player going over some of the better things their character can do that aren't always obvious (like Spectral Hand and Shivering Touch).</p><p></p><p>4: Tying very much into the above two, the DM should vet everything. Yes, it can be a pain in the butt, but do keep in mind that it helps tremendously to know what your players and their characters are capable of in order to make fun and interesting adventures for them. If they're expecting fun challenges and then steamroll through it or die in the first few encounters then someone screwed up. It might have been the players not making use of their resources like the DM thought they would (could be a player or DM mistake), or it might have been the DM miscalculating just how powerful or weak something was.</p><p></p><p>4a: Vetting everything also helps keep surprises to a minimum. If you know the wizard can cast Spectral Hand and Shivering Touch, don't be surprised when that dragon gets its Dex damaged to 0 and then killed by a Coup de Grace while it's helpless, assuming you didn't give it protections against that kind of stuff (which any dragon would have if the spell is any kind of known.)</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Jackinthegreen, post: 6155276, member: 6678119"] Restricting books and items and such is usually more of an excuse for saying "I can't be bothered to learn the rules for these things, so I'm just going to ban them." Now, saying you aren't going to learn a certain rules set isn't a bad thing necessarily since it can take considerable time and effort to do that you might not be able to put in. But there are definitely those DMs who do it out of laziness or ignorance of how great some of the non-core stuff is. Some of the better ways to nip crazy stuff in the bud though: 1: Don't play with abusive players. If you know someone is going to try to break the game and make things difficult for everyone, don't invite them to play. Or if they do end up playing, see the rest of this list for ways on how to deal with them. 2: All players must be able to cite the sources for stuff that isn't well-known to the group (and even some well-known stuff should get a look at. I once played with a guy who thought rangers only got one Favored Enemy when they very clearly get 5 by level 20). This means actually being able to open the book, website, etc and show the DM the exact rules. 3: All players must be able to actually describe the rules for their character, and put in the effort to actually help the DM go through them if something seems off. If they can't be bothered to help the DM understand what's going on (and do so civilly too) then they need to act their act together. And definitely make sure you have the player going over some of the better things their character can do that aren't always obvious (like Spectral Hand and Shivering Touch). 4: Tying very much into the above two, the DM should vet everything. Yes, it can be a pain in the butt, but do keep in mind that it helps tremendously to know what your players and their characters are capable of in order to make fun and interesting adventures for them. If they're expecting fun challenges and then steamroll through it or die in the first few encounters then someone screwed up. It might have been the players not making use of their resources like the DM thought they would (could be a player or DM mistake), or it might have been the DM miscalculating just how powerful or weak something was. 4a: Vetting everything also helps keep surprises to a minimum. If you know the wizard can cast Spectral Hand and Shivering Touch, don't be surprised when that dragon gets its Dex damaged to 0 and then killed by a Coup de Grace while it's helpless, assuming you didn't give it protections against that kind of stuff (which any dragon would have if the spell is any kind of known.) [/QUOTE]
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