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Message: <blockquote data-quote="KarinsDad" data-source="post: 2115502" data-attributes="member: 2011">First, we should look at this with regard to "normal initiative rules" (i.e. without allowing readying actions to trigger the start of combat).The DM rules that the disturbance results in a surprise round and initiative rolls for those who are not surprised. This normally means that the guardsmen, the bowman, and the patrolman get to roll Spot or Listen rolls. However, the patrolman cannot see the disturbance, he might only hear the crowd's reaction to the disturbance. So, his Listen DC might be higher. But, he was planning on attacking the bowman as quickly as possible anyway, so I would automatically allow him to roll in the surprise round if he is close enough to the Bowman to act.The guardsmen will at first be attracted to the disturbance, so their Spot DCs might be higher as well.The bowman probably has the best chance to take advantage of the disturbance since he was waiting for an opportune shot anyway. Since he was effectively planning on initiating combat anyway, I would not normally require him to make a Spot or Listen check, only an initiative roll in the surprise round.So, a minimum of two initiative rolls in the surprise round, one for the bowman and one for the patrolman and possibly one or two for some very alert guardsmen or even the King.This assumes that the timing is so close that the Patrolman does not simply get to act in the surprise round because the Bowman is waiting until the King gets even closer (maybe the King is 200 feet away when the Patrolman spots the Bowman).How would this change if you allowed combat to start before this and the bowman got to hold a ready action for multiple rounds?Well, it depends on what he is readying for. If he is readying for the King to reach a given location for a "perfect shot" and the king has not yet gotten there, then he has to wait until his next initiative to change his readied action. If the King does not get to the location until after the Patrolman's initiative, then the Patrolman goes before the Bowman can fire and can try to disrupt it. If the King gets there first, then the Bowman shoots before the Patrolman gets there. The guardmen could still make Spot rolls because of the disturbance and could still act before the Bowman if their initiatives have not yet come up.So, very little difference between the two scenarios.But the problem with this scenario is that it is not one in which the Bowman would want to do a ready to initiate combat. It is one in which he would want fire his bow to initiate combat. So, it is not a very good example for comparison.</blockquote>

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