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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Silverblade The Ench" data-source="post: 4295230" data-attributes="member: 19083">1) I hated the 3rd ed half-giants in Exp Psi handbook, totally weak sauce, ugh!!half-giants are LARGE, scary badasses, but pretty dumb <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f61b.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":p" title="Stick out tongue    :p"  data-smilie="7"data-shortname=":p" />2) 4th ed has no ECL! in 3rd ed, ECL usually screwed characters up badly if they had racial hit dice.IMHO, racial hit dice = bad, for characters. As it reduces their character abilities.Hence, your minotaur hero, even with racial advantages, would be not nearly as effective as an equivalent fighter.Thus, racial hit dice should not be used, IMHO, in 4th ed, if it can be avoided.4th ed is about bonuses, not penalties. But some creatures are not very bright etc. it's FUN to play some nasty critter, within limits, and half-giants are a  valid character race in Dark Sun.3) My suggestion for Dark Sun half-giants in 4th ed.EDITfrom folk's input on WOTC forums etc:hm, well if the bonus to strength and size IS their entire racial bonus, it should be ok?And lose any stat penalties, in line with 4th ed.no racial "ability" (their strength and size is that) so remove the "Unstoppable" power.so +4 Str/Con. Large size, Rach 2. Until further info, go with RL common sense stuff based on mass and simplification. Halfgiants have about x8 to x10 Human mass beng 10' to 12' high, but also massively built, (double size 2x2x2= 8, but for simplicty and massive build say x10).base gear cost of size so x10 cost for gear. That cost and water useage is a penalty in DS!!Halfgiants NEED Large sized equipment, non large sized weapons give -2 hit penalty. (in 4th ed most penalties are -2 as standard, or -5 if severe).Human 2 hand wepaons can be used 1 handed at that penalty.A greatsword would still have too thin a handle etc for halfgiant comfort, though they would use it 1 handed.ALso, size is a problem, they'd be "squeezing" or whaetever in many instances, as Human builngs are moslty 7' to 10' ceiling, so DM's need to keep note on that. Simple rule would this:Halfgint size means that unless a roof is 15' or more high, they suffer a -2 attack penalty due ot insufficent space, unless they use a Light weapon.Alignment left ot a "fluff" item. As IMHO, it is more like long term ethical shifts than morals?So, new rules in totothat seem ok? <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" /></blockquote>

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