How to portray long or challenging tasks in an interesting way

[jshaft37]

I run my campaigns pretty sandboxy and without much prep. I let the characters decide what they want to do, so I can't plan flowery language and interesting what/if scenarios for every situation. Usually I'm pretty good but there's one situation that I always fail.

The long, challenging, and sometimes mundane task, especially when I want the PCs to succeed.

Crossing a desert, looking for a hidden encampment, tracking an enemy, researching in a library, etc.

I've tried to throw together some skill challenges on the fly, but those haven't been any more exciting really. Since I want the PCs to succeed, its hard to determine failure penalties, and I hate the "lose a healing surge" penalty.

I suppose I could describe the situation and be sure to mention the challenge, but I'd rather find a better, more interesting way to improve my DMing. Especially to get the PCs involved more.

 

[SensoryThought]

Critical hits podcast did a recent one on skill challenges that is definitely worth listening to. They talk about what makes it interesting.

Crossing a desert for me is a boring skill challenge, particularly if they are well prepared. CH gave the example of crossing a rickety bridge. Boring unless you amp ip the tension - you are being chased and the bridge is on fire.

For me, if I wanted to make the desert crossing interesting I'd have them have a urgency - they need to cross it ill-prepared in a week to catch the macguffin. I'd have them roll Endurance DC15 on the first day (fail = lose 2 surges that aren't recovered on a long rest). Nature check (skilled only) the next day to find water, or else the DC is 20.

Next day they come across an oasis with nomads. History check (skilled) to know the tribe has a culture where they must welcome those who offer gifts. They can use Diplomacy, Bluff, Intimidate to deal for food, water, or camels.

Fast forward a few days and give a perception check to notice an approaching disturbance in the sand. Failure = surprise. Short combat encounter with a giant scorpion (or sand worm etc). Heal check to treat the poisoned pcs including nature check to find neutralizing cactus flowers.

Enough skill checks and they cross in time to catch the macguffin.

In general, failure in skill checks should not stop the story, only add complications the PCs must think or RP their way out of.

 

[jshaft37]

Indeed, I'm always kicking myself for not introducing a time-element before I run into these "dead-air" scenarios.

I guess my issue is doing these things "on the fly" since I may not have planned for them. If I plant a quest seed that has them traveling through a dangerous environment, I can plan accordingly, but would probably still skip it. That was probably a bad example.

 

[Balesir]

I've tried to throw together some skill challenges on the fly, but those haven't been any more exciting really. Since I want the PCs to succeed, its hard to determine failure penalties, and I hate the "lose a healing surge" penalty.

I'm growing to like Skill challenges, but it was a half-baked system when first presented, I think. Some points to try/remember:

- Instead of healing surge loss try minor combat or trap encounters. Take 1/3 to 1/2 of the XP for the Skill challenge as your budget, but the characters don't get any XP for the fight at all (it's just the cost of failing). Each failure in the challenge means one such encounter. The encounters should be pretty trivial - they just take the odd surge away.

- Have each success in a travel challenge relate to a specific site on the travel map. Sites might contain information and/or clues about the destination/plot, or might have opportunities to find treasure. With this setup, the party can arrive at the destination whether they succeed or fail at the overall challenge - failure will simply mean that they arrive tired, unprepared, beaten up a bit by the minor "failure" encounters and without any bonus treasure they might have found...

- Think about how the challenge you have planned would pan out "old style" with just skill rolls, if you are used to running that way in the past. If it would have been boring as watching paint dry, the chances are it will be a poor Skill challenge, too. You need to either think of reasons for it to be interesting, or just narrate it as a quick "link scene".

- Remember automatic successes! For instance, if a well prepared party could breeze accross a desert with no problems, start by thinking what "well prepared" means. List the items required: suitable mounts, adequate water, food and fuel, shelter (tents?), a navigation technique/route map and so on. Assume that a party with all these gets auto-successes enough to complete the journey. Now think what skill rolls might be substituted if a party lacks each of those elements of "well prepared". Hunger and thirst may really be best represented by healing surge loss, but navigational failures are more likely to give "failure encounters" and other lacking elements may lead to lost gear, rather than lost surges...

- Library searches give snippets of information with each success. Failures can give accidental damage (requires payment/Diplomacy, and eventually gets the party ejected from the library, maybe) or permanently lost resources (like maps that you might have given as handouts). Final failure means no further information will be found, regardless how long the search continues.

 

[LostSoul]

Do you have a write-up or an example of a previous skill challenge you used in the game? I think the situation that framed that skill challenge could help out in any advice.

In general, I'd say that you want to use a skill challenge when you're looking for some unexpected results or consequences. Not necessarily bad things to happen to the PCs, but something you didn't plan for - based on the interaction of a DM-generated obstacle or challenge and player-generated PC actions in response.

 

[jshaft37]

Do you have a write-up or an example of a previous skill challenge you used in the game? I think the situation that framed that skill challenge could help out in any advice.

In general, I'd say that you want to use a skill challenge when you're looking for some unexpected results or consequences. Not necessarily bad things to happen to the PCs, but something you didn't plan for - based on the interaction of a DM-generated obstacle or challenge and player-generated PC actions in response.

No, because what I'm talking about here is always something I've had to do on the fly. I have done planned skill challenges and those go fine.

I don't really want to use a skill challenge, necessarily, I was just stating that I've tried to use that mechanic and it really didn't improve drama or excitement.

In a recent session, the group was moving down a long tunnel into a mining area. I didn't expect them to make such a big deal about the tunnel and it would just be something we'd breeze through. Next thing I know the group is preparing sun-rods, the assassin popped his stealth daily, and the group is prepping for something major, when all I had planned was a long twisting tunnel that I thought fit well into the environment/mood and hadn't planned on much passed that. Next thing you know they are moving along at a snail's pace, but I didn't have ANYTHING to throw at them, and my brain as really failing. I ended up throwing some lame hazards at them, but they seemed forced in my opinion.

 

[LostSoul]

Your example of heading down a dungeon tunnel that you hadn't planned to be dangerous brings up an interesting question: do you feel that you should meet the player's expectations with some sort of encounter, especially since they're expending resources? Is that the kind of game you're playing, or do you want to say, "You travel for a while and exit the tunnel without any encounters."

(I use wandering monsters - in a different way than would be applied here, but that could help give you something to work with.)

A discussion of "scene framing" would be appropriate here. [MENTION=42582]pemerton[/MENTION] can probably provide a lot more advice on this topic than I ever could.

 

[Quickleaf]

Crossing a desert, looking for a hidden encampment, tracking an enemy, researching in a library, etc.

If these situations really are giving you so much trouble why not run them as group skill checks or simply narrate the passage of time?

Skill challenges are only as good as the imagination allows, so if you can't come up with interesting developments and failure scenarios for, say, crossing the desert...leave it at that and move on to what you do well.

I'm curious though what your first thoughts are when running an improv skill challenge?

 

[Mengu]

Yeah crossing a desert by itself, is a boring challenge. Crossing a desert while there are two Efreets on your tail? That's more interesting, but can still become just a string of rolls. Ultimately, it's your ability to engage the players in the skill challenge, and their desire to *be* engaged in the skill challenge, that will make it interesting.

I've played through an LFR module with such a challenge 3 times, each time with a different group. First two times were awesome, the challenge was well thought out, the DM's were engaged, the players were engaged, felt great. Third time around, the DM did what he could, but the group seemed totally disinterested, and just wanted to get to the combat bits, and had the attitude of whatever, let's roll some dice, tell us how many surges we lose, and do the combats. And with that attitude, it didn't really matter if we were crossing a desert, swimming up a river, or digging tunnels in a mine, the challenge didn't add tangible value to the adventure.

I think it's the group's attitude that makes such challenges interesting, or boring.

 

[jshaft37]

I'm curious though what your first thoughts are when running an improv skill challenge?

If applicable:

PC Goals
NPC Goals
Environment

I basically try to put together something based on the situation and what the PC's have given me via roll playing and character personalities. I always try to say "yes" and tailor the game to the players. I can't really think of any specifics in hindsight, but I'll try to remember next time it comes up.