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How valuable is the shield?
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<blockquote data-quote="FormerlyHemlock" data-source="post: 7159507" data-attributes="member: 6787650"><p>[shrug] So what? "In preparing for battle I have always found that plans are useless, but planning is indispensable." Right now we're on the Internet, not at a table. By definition we're doing the "planning" part, which includes thoroughly understanding all your options, not the "in battle" part.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>On the other hand, Athletics Expertise + Cutting Words will help quite a bit. And now your giant has spent two rounds Dashing and then grappling, while sucking up attacks and opportunity attacks from PCs and a swarm of conjured animals. Historically I haven't seen that kind of thing work out very well for the giant at all. Maybe if the giants outnumbered the PCs (Quadruple-Deadly fight or worse) and were the ones ambushing the PCs it would work out better. Realistically the wolf pack/etc. is only going to account for one or two giants over the first two or three rounds of combat--if there are six giants then yes, the bard would be foolish to wear a shield into battle because in that battle survival, not winning efficiently, is top priority.</p><p></p><p>But come on, how many times do you see four 11th level PCs tangling with six Frost Giants? (I mean, <em>I</em> love that kind of thing as a DM, but does your DM? And I run Combat As War anyway so even then I'm not going to force the players into a straight-up fight.) That's a more extreme edge case than the one you accused Sacrosanct of.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Precisely why, in a more normal battle, it's useful for the squishy bard to have the option to whip out his shield and lie prone, if no total cover is available and if he's not within 40' of the enemy, thus removing himself as an attractive target. Maybe you were going to beat those goblins anyway, but it's sure nice to have the option to beat them without the bard losing 30 HP in the process.</p><p></p><p>Think of it as the inverse of (Dodge + bonus action Shield of Faith), except that it only works against ranged weapons and it doesn't cost any spell points/slots.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Er, so what? News flash: bards are squishy! +2 to AC doesn't make you invulnerable! What a shocker.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>It's not a basic assumption of play, but you're correct that it's a basic prerequisite for when you'd want to don your shield--you have to be reasonably confident that you don't really need to do any spellcasting in the next six seconds, possibly because you're already concentrating on the spell you want most.</p><p></p><p><strong>To sum up:</strong> being able to don a shield, even if you're nonproficient, is a useful capability under some circumstances, and carrying one costs you nothing but 6 lb. of encumbrance. Even if you're a sorcerer or a bardlock or something, you should consider doing so. The penalties for wearing armor nonproficiently are milder than you think.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="FormerlyHemlock, post: 7159507, member: 6787650"] [shrug] So what? "In preparing for battle I have always found that plans are useless, but planning is indispensable." Right now we're on the Internet, not at a table. By definition we're doing the "planning" part, which includes thoroughly understanding all your options, not the "in battle" part. On the other hand, Athletics Expertise + Cutting Words will help quite a bit. And now your giant has spent two rounds Dashing and then grappling, while sucking up attacks and opportunity attacks from PCs and a swarm of conjured animals. Historically I haven't seen that kind of thing work out very well for the giant at all. Maybe if the giants outnumbered the PCs (Quadruple-Deadly fight or worse) and were the ones ambushing the PCs it would work out better. Realistically the wolf pack/etc. is only going to account for one or two giants over the first two or three rounds of combat--if there are six giants then yes, the bard would be foolish to wear a shield into battle because in that battle survival, not winning efficiently, is top priority. But come on, how many times do you see four 11th level PCs tangling with six Frost Giants? (I mean, [I]I[/I] love that kind of thing as a DM, but does your DM? And I run Combat As War anyway so even then I'm not going to force the players into a straight-up fight.) That's a more extreme edge case than the one you accused Sacrosanct of. Precisely why, in a more normal battle, it's useful for the squishy bard to have the option to whip out his shield and lie prone, if no total cover is available and if he's not within 40' of the enemy, thus removing himself as an attractive target. Maybe you were going to beat those goblins anyway, but it's sure nice to have the option to beat them without the bard losing 30 HP in the process. Think of it as the inverse of (Dodge + bonus action Shield of Faith), except that it only works against ranged weapons and it doesn't cost any spell points/slots. Er, so what? News flash: bards are squishy! +2 to AC doesn't make you invulnerable! What a shocker. It's not a basic assumption of play, but you're correct that it's a basic prerequisite for when you'd want to don your shield--you have to be reasonably confident that you don't really need to do any spellcasting in the next six seconds, possibly because you're already concentrating on the spell you want most. [B]To sum up:[/B] being able to don a shield, even if you're nonproficient, is a useful capability under some circumstances, and carrying one costs you nothing but 6 lb. of encumbrance. Even if you're a sorcerer or a bardlock or something, you should consider doing so. The penalties for wearing armor nonproficiently are milder than you think. [/QUOTE]
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