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Message: <blockquote data-quote="GreyLord" data-source="post: 7892541" data-attributes="member: 4348">And yet, you are the one that are wanting to ignore the other three movies by George Lucas???Or, even, ignore the themes of the trilogy as a whole for the OT??Really...We can either look at the Trilogy as it starts out (without the revisionism...in which case this is NOT a theme of the original movie, or even the second movie.  We have a revelation at the end of the Second movie which does NOT say he is going to be redeemed or not...in fact, he's been the villain the entire time up until then)...or we can look at all the stuff that Lucas put in.The original trilogy didn't have Vader being redeemed as a real theme until the last movie.  At that point, it was still the Good Guys vs. the Bad Guys...and Vader is a very bad guy.What do you mean?I'm not swiping away the main story.  The main story is the same story line and idea as well as theme that extends from the first to the third movie of the Original Trilogy...not an idea introduced at the end of the Second movie and becomes a part of the ideas of the third.  It is a MAIN theme of the third movie, but not the entire trilogy.The only way to see Vader being redeemed to Anakin as a main theme is to include the prequels.Otherwise, it's the story of the Rebels vs. the Empire first and foremost (we don't even meet Luke until a fifth of the way through the first movie).  Secondly, it's about Luke's journey from a boy to a man (first in the first movie of a boy to a hero, and then his becoming more mature from that movie onwards). Vader's redemption is NOT central to his becoming a Man or a Jedi per se.  He only had to face Vader.  It BECOMES more of a theme in the third movie, but we see a whole lot of growth up until then.NOW IF, we include the prequels (which for some reason, you WANT to use them for their themes...but don't want to include them which is...ironic)...you are absolutely correct.But prior to the prequels...Vader's redemption is not actually  necessary to the story.  If you take out his entire redemption arc but still have him and the Emperor defeated in some manner Luke has still made the journey from Boy to Man...and the Rebellion still wins that fight.Anyways, I'm not sure why I'm even discussing this.  I started giving an explanation of how some people (and not even necessarily my thoughts or views) would see it as an explanation and instead am being drawn into a conversation I really didn't have an real deep interest in, in the first place.</blockquote>[/QUOTE][/QUOTE]

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