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<blockquote data-quote="Plane Sailing" data-source="post: 5483169" data-attributes="member: 114">OK, I see your question now.I was making the point that, despite what I often see posted here about wizards being better than fighters at everything, they are actually not as good at actually doing damage to opponents. their ability to ablate hit points is far worse than equivalent level fighters.i.e. fighters are currently better than wizards at a major element of combat.Thus my point stands - if wizards are less good at finishing a combat with damage, but have more general utility, where is the problem? Presumably in the save-or-end-fight spells (which are a bit of a gamble - and is the issue the presence of the spells or the ease of cranking up save DC?&nbsp; What if save DCs were always 10 + half caster level and saves were always + half defenders level, and classes have one strong save with +2 on top of that - and all ability bonuses were ditched (both on DC and save)? Would a base 55% save against equal level foes be OK? or should it be a better chance of saving? Perhaps DC is just 10+ spell level with no improvements, so 1st level spells are always just DC11 to save?Is it the plot bypassing spells? What if they were rituals that could be learned by anyone with the appropriate feat (as per 4e)?</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Plane Sailing, post: 5483169, member: 114"] OK, I see your question now. I was making the point that, despite what I often see posted here about wizards being better than fighters at everything, they are actually not as good at actually doing damage to opponents. their ability to ablate hit points is far worse than equivalent level fighters. i.e. fighters are currently better than wizards at a major element of combat. Thus my point stands - if wizards are less good at finishing a combat with damage, but have more general utility, where is the problem? Presumably in the save-or-end-fight spells (which are a bit of a gamble - and is the issue the presence of the spells or the ease of cranking up save DC? What if save DCs were always 10 + half caster level and saves were always + half defenders level, and classes have one strong save with +2 on top of that - and all ability bonuses were ditched (both on DC and save)? Would a base 55% save against equal level foes be OK? or should it be a better chance of saving? Perhaps DC is just 10+ spell level with no improvements, so 1st level spells are always just DC11 to save? Is it the plot bypassing spells? What if they were rituals that could be learned by anyone with the appropriate feat (as per 4e)? [/QUOTE]

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