Reply to thread

Message: <blockquote data-quote="Andor" data-source="post: 5818638" data-attributes="member: 1879">Functions were always there. But that's not the same thing as explicit roles. A Fighter was a fighter. He could serve as a defender, he could serve as a striker. In 3e he could even serve as a controller. Spec how you please. He also had the classic "Fighter's lockpick."4e? Defender. With carefully defined power ranges to avoid him stepping on the Rogue or Wizards toes.Explicit roles limit PC options, player creativity and game design options.Lets suppose for example you want to make a character who (to borrow an MMO term) does debuffs. In 3e you might make a Duskblade, or a Binder or talk your GM into allowing Bard who applies his bard buffs as malus to the badguys instead of bonus to the good guys. Or pick a spell caster and gun for debillitating spells. Necromancer would work well.In 4e? You are outside the accepted design space. Possibly you could shoehorn that into the controller role. Maybe they even did that later on, I don't know. Look at d20 Modern. Does that fit with the 4 roles? It does not. You might make a charatcer to fulfill one of the functions of that role. Or you could make a hacker who like to jetski.Look at 7th sea. Dungeon crawls were solidly supported by the worlds design. The 4 roles of D&D? Almost completely absent. (I say almost because you could go for an arnoured fighter and try to tank. Still no healers to back you up though.)Like I've said, I think roles are a useful tool for design when used implicitly to inform the game. I think they are a terrible thing to make explicit and hardcoded.Frex, one of my favorite late 3e classes was the Dragon Shaman. With hindsight it shows clear signs of being an early dabbleing with 4e design philosophies. He's got some heal, some buffing, minor area damge. A leader/controller then.You know what I did with them? 1 level as a Knight or Fighter to get heavy armour and martial weapons and turn them into frontline Defender types.Easy in 3e with no explict roles, but the same functions. In 4e? Not doable, because of the rigidity of the design specifications.</blockquote>

Verification