Menu
News
All News
Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
Pathfinder
Starfinder
Warhammer
2d20 System
Year Zero Engine
Industry News
Reviews
Dragon Reflections
White Dwarf Reflections
Columns
Weekly Digests
Weekly News Digest
Freebies, Sales & Bundles
RPG Print News
RPG Crowdfunding News
Game Content
ENterplanetary DimENsions
Mythological Figures
Opinion
Worlds of Design
Peregrine's Nest
RPG Evolution
Other Columns
From the Freelancing Frontline
Monster ENcyclopedia
WotC/TSR Alumni Look Back
4 Hours w/RSD (Ryan Dancey)
The Road to 3E (Jonathan Tweet)
Greenwood's Realms (Ed Greenwood)
Drawmij's TSR (Jim Ward)
Community
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Resources
Wiki
Pages
Latest activity
Media
New media
New comments
Search media
Downloads
Latest reviews
Search resources
EN Publishing
Store
EN5ider
Adventures in ZEITGEIST
Awfully Cheerful Engine
What's OLD is NEW
Judge Dredd & The Worlds Of 2000AD
War of the Burning Sky
Level Up: Advanced 5E
Events & Releases
Upcoming Events
Private Events
Featured Events
Socials!
EN Publishing
Twitter
BlueSky
Facebook
Instagram
EN World
BlueSky
YouTube
Facebook
Twitter
Twitch
Podcast
Features
Top 5 RPGs Compiled Charts 2004-Present
Adventure Game Industry Market Research Summary (RPGs) V1.0
Ryan Dancey: Acquiring TSR
Q&A With Gary Gygax
D&D Rules FAQs
TSR, WotC, & Paizo: A Comparative History
D&D Pronunciation Guide
Million Dollar TTRPG Kickstarters
Tabletop RPG Podcast Hall of Fame
Eric Noah's Unofficial D&D 3rd Edition News
D&D in the Mainstream
D&D & RPG History
About Morrus
Log in
Register
What's new
Search
Search
Search titles only
By:
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
Upgrade your account to a Community Supporter account and remove most of the site ads.
Rocket your D&D 5E and Level Up: Advanced 5E games into space! Alpha Star Magazine Is Launching... Right Now!
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*TTRPGs General
Human Dominance
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="fusangite" data-source="post: 1907685" data-attributes="member: 7240"><p>Tonguez,</p><p></p><p>I think you need to clarify a few things before I can comment on your model:</p><p>(a) what aspects of a creature are capable of adapting (ie. changing) physically, mentally and socially? (Socially is an important question because of the way chaotic alignments seem to function as a disability under the system.)</p><p>(b) are creatures created by the god(s) they worship or is the creation of species done by particular gods with responsibility for more than one species?</p><p>(c) if survival factors are contingent upon the environment, aren't gods of particular plants or animals going to have a kind of secondary jurisdiction over the survival of creatures that depend on them?</p><p>(d) do the deities of non-sentient life recognize the life forms they patronize as lower in the hierarchy than sentient creatures?</p><p>(e) if different creator gods have different agendas, how is their relative success determined?</p><p></p><p>In Aristotelian physics, the system I apply most frequently to fill gaps in natural philosophy that the rules do not, there is no environmental adaptation. Because there is one god who favours humankind in a sacred natural order, the production of a particular ecological feature like the Nile River is predetermined based on the anticipated needs of the creatures dependent upon it. Because every object has a purpose, what the object does is comprehended in terms of fulfillment of said purpose. </p><p></p><p>Now this can be adapted (indeed was designed <em>for</em>) a hierarchical polytheistic system -- but it doesn't work for a polytheistic system without a clear order of precedence. If there is no single universal order, this physics does not work. </p><p></p><p>If you substitute an essentially ecological order, which you seem to be proposing, there is a real problem: not only must the humans make sense ecologically, the whole D&D system must make sense ecologically. Why would kobolds continue to exist? They are not as well-designed as goblins and hobgoblins and occupy the same ecological niche. Now, if there is a divine order in which kobolds are supposed to live and the created world actively facilitates this, that is one thing but if creation is just a big design competition amongst the gods, why don't some gods just lose?</p><p></p><p>It seems to me that the only way to make your system work is to consign kobolds to some Galapagos-esque environment where there are no other subterranean monstrous humanoids competing to occupy the same niche. So, my first reaction to your idea is yes, it could work but in a widely dispersed low-magic, low-tech archipelago. I see that you essentially acknowledge that in your proposal when it comes to elven sub-races but this is when you suggest a species adapted to multiple niches; a very different problem arises when you have multiple species adapted to a single niche.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="fusangite, post: 1907685, member: 7240"] Tonguez, I think you need to clarify a few things before I can comment on your model: (a) what aspects of a creature are capable of adapting (ie. changing) physically, mentally and socially? (Socially is an important question because of the way chaotic alignments seem to function as a disability under the system.) (b) are creatures created by the god(s) they worship or is the creation of species done by particular gods with responsibility for more than one species? (c) if survival factors are contingent upon the environment, aren't gods of particular plants or animals going to have a kind of secondary jurisdiction over the survival of creatures that depend on them? (d) do the deities of non-sentient life recognize the life forms they patronize as lower in the hierarchy than sentient creatures? (e) if different creator gods have different agendas, how is their relative success determined? In Aristotelian physics, the system I apply most frequently to fill gaps in natural philosophy that the rules do not, there is no environmental adaptation. Because there is one god who favours humankind in a sacred natural order, the production of a particular ecological feature like the Nile River is predetermined based on the anticipated needs of the creatures dependent upon it. Because every object has a purpose, what the object does is comprehended in terms of fulfillment of said purpose. Now this can be adapted (indeed was designed [i]for[/i]) a hierarchical polytheistic system -- but it doesn't work for a polytheistic system without a clear order of precedence. If there is no single universal order, this physics does not work. If you substitute an essentially ecological order, which you seem to be proposing, there is a real problem: not only must the humans make sense ecologically, the whole D&D system must make sense ecologically. Why would kobolds continue to exist? They are not as well-designed as goblins and hobgoblins and occupy the same ecological niche. Now, if there is a divine order in which kobolds are supposed to live and the created world actively facilitates this, that is one thing but if creation is just a big design competition amongst the gods, why don't some gods just lose? It seems to me that the only way to make your system work is to consign kobolds to some Galapagos-esque environment where there are no other subterranean monstrous humanoids competing to occupy the same niche. So, my first reaction to your idea is yes, it could work but in a widely dispersed low-magic, low-tech archipelago. I see that you essentially acknowledge that in your proposal when it comes to elven sub-races but this is when you suggest a species adapted to multiple niches; a very different problem arises when you have multiple species adapted to a single niche. [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*TTRPGs General
Human Dominance
Top