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I don't actually get the opposition for the warlord... or rather the opposition to the concept.
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<blockquote data-quote="El Mahdi" data-source="post: 6754518" data-attributes="member: 59506"><p>Coaches most definitely do give guidance and feedback during games. Even in European Football, coaches yell input from the sidelines quite often.</p><p></p><p>But coaches aren't the only example. In American Football, the primary "Leader" position is the quarterback. They most definitely call out guidance to the other players. Linebackers are obviously the expert at their position, yet Quarterbacks often point out members of the defense to pay attention to or highlight positioning aspects that may signal what the Defense is planning (Blitz, stuff the run, full pass coverage, prevent defense, etc.)</p><p></p><p>Peyton Manning is one of the best examples. Arguably one of the best field generals in the history of the game. He makes any team he quarterbacks for - better. He makes any player he plays with - better.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Not true. American Football coaches have done this for decades - though less often today. This is one of the reasons we've had such extensive research into the long-term effects of concussions in the last few years. Getting players back on their feet and back in the fight/game despite significant concussion damage. Now we're finding that many of these players are dying earlier than they should (in retirement) due to <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chronic_traumatic_encephalopathy" target="_blank">Chronic_traumatic_encephalopathy</a> . (specifically <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chronic_traumatic_encephalopathy#History" target="_blank">here</a> and <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Concussions_in_American_football" target="_blank">here</a> ) But coaches have been able to pep talk there players back on to the field since the beginning of the game, inspiring players to overcome the short-term effects of injury.</p><p></p><p>The long term effects - many years down the road - are another story altogether...</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Frankly, I find this a bit condescending. It comes across to me as saying the desire for a no-magic campaign is bad-wrong-fun. That the game cannot be played without magic. It's the equivalent of saying that real-life isn't possible because magic doesn't exist.</p><p></p><p>Magic is something outside of reality, outside of nature - literally <em>supernatural</em>. Fictionally, magic can be used metaphorically, used to highlight or contrast other aspects, or quite often as a mere <em>deus ex machina</em> to accomplish things that otherwise cannot. In games, magic can be all of those things, or used simply for the enjoyment of pretending to do something beyond the realms of reality.</p><p></p><p>There are some, including myself, that like to have the human spirit be the Magic without using<em> actual </em>Magic.</p><p></p><p>All are perfectly reasonable approaches. There are as many styles of D&D and approaches to the game as there are tables that D&D is played on. The desire for running a non-magic game is hardly an unheard of approach. It's certainly something that seems reasonable for an edition meant to be inclusive.</p><p></p><p>A Warlord class facilitates that kind of play, along with bringing other desired aspects of which I mentioned before.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>You're new to the Warlord conversations here at ENWorld...Yes?</p><p></p><p>Warlords don't cause wounds to close or bones to knit together using words. Mostly, it's those that want to discredit the concept of a Warlord that say this, and not fans of the Warlord.</p><p></p><p>First, D&D Hit Points don't express as "broken bones." They don't even express as "open wounds." D&D Hit Points are vague - on purpose - and they constitute more than just meat, as per the rules definition of Hit Points (physical durability, mental durability, luck and will to live). Things like broken bones or other obviously debilitating injuries would be the realm of critical hits and lingering wounds. Lingering wounds are an optional aspect of the game. The standard D&D rules do not include effects for broken bones or anything else - there is no debilitating effect of Hit Point loss until one hits zero. D&D Hit Points are not that granular.</p><p></p><p>However, if one used Lingering Wounds or Specific Wounds (broken bones, etc.) in a game, and applied penalties based on those, I think such wounds should require some kind of special treatment - and No, Warlord Inspiration wouldn't necessarily help (depending on the type of wound).</p><p></p><p>Second, Inspiration can, physiologically, improve one's physical condition. It's very rare and very extraordinary, but extraordinary is what the game is all about (as you said<img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f609.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=";)" title="Wink ;)" data-smilie="2"data-shortname=";)" />).</p><p></p><p>An inspirational exhortation triggers a sympathetic nervous system response. That response generates a surge of adrenaline, endorphins, serotonin and dopamine. This causes pain mitigation (physical and mental durability), an increase in blood pressure - allowing the body to regain homeostasis (physical durability), makes one feel more optimistic (mental durability, will to live), and promotes blood clotting (physical durability).</p><p></p><p>Yes, the actual "cuts" may still exist, but there effect has largely been neutralized. That is Hit Point recovery.</p><p></p><p>But honestly, the real-world explanation shouldn't be necessary. Warlord inspirational hit point recovery is consistent with the game's definition of Hit Points - and that's all that should matter.</p><p></p><p>Also, one can't make an argument that Inspirational Recovery is illogical or doesn't make sense, when one also accepts that simply sleeping 8 hours completely heals a person of all wounds.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>One thing about actually serving in the military, rather than just participating in an academic discussion or a detached simulation, is that I've been immersed in a culture where Leadership is a very real, tangible, and omnipresent thing.</p><p></p><p>Leadership is not limited to just those who are in charge, and Leadership does not require one to be in charge. Leadership is a quality that anyone can possess, but it must be cultivated. Leadership requires above all things, Conscientiousness. Exercising leadership does not require telling people what to do, just as following doesn't necessarily mean subordinate. In a really good team, everybody is a Leader - which is why the Military teaches and cultivates Leadership throughout every stage of one's career - regardless of rank. From moment to moment, one might find themselves following or leading as the situation dictates. People don't only follow leaders because they have to, they most often do it because it's mutually beneficial. Leadership can be exercised through advice as well as orders - but most often displayed through example.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>What you're talking about is Authority, not Leadership. It really helps to differentiate between the two concepts.</p><p></p><p>In the game, I'd absolutely have a problem with another character having authority over my character.</p><p></p><p>That is not what a Warlord does.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="El Mahdi, post: 6754518, member: 59506"] Coaches most definitely do give guidance and feedback during games. Even in European Football, coaches yell input from the sidelines quite often. But coaches aren't the only example. In American Football, the primary "Leader" position is the quarterback. They most definitely call out guidance to the other players. Linebackers are obviously the expert at their position, yet Quarterbacks often point out members of the defense to pay attention to or highlight positioning aspects that may signal what the Defense is planning (Blitz, stuff the run, full pass coverage, prevent defense, etc.) Peyton Manning is one of the best examples. Arguably one of the best field generals in the history of the game. He makes any team he quarterbacks for - better. He makes any player he plays with - better. Not true. American Football coaches have done this for decades - though less often today. This is one of the reasons we've had such extensive research into the long-term effects of concussions in the last few years. Getting players back on their feet and back in the fight/game despite significant concussion damage. Now we're finding that many of these players are dying earlier than they should (in retirement) due to [URL="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chronic_traumatic_encephalopathy"]Chronic_traumatic_encephalopathy[/URL] . (specifically [URL="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chronic_traumatic_encephalopathy#History"]here[/URL] and [URL="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Concussions_in_American_football"]here[/URL] ) But coaches have been able to pep talk there players back on to the field since the beginning of the game, inspiring players to overcome the short-term effects of injury. The long term effects - many years down the road - are another story altogether... Frankly, I find this a bit condescending. It comes across to me as saying the desire for a no-magic campaign is bad-wrong-fun. That the game cannot be played without magic. It's the equivalent of saying that real-life isn't possible because magic doesn't exist. Magic is something outside of reality, outside of nature - literally [I]supernatural[/I]. Fictionally, magic can be used metaphorically, used to highlight or contrast other aspects, or quite often as a mere [I]deus ex machina[/I] to accomplish things that otherwise cannot. In games, magic can be all of those things, or used simply for the enjoyment of pretending to do something beyond the realms of reality. There are some, including myself, that like to have the human spirit be the Magic without using[I] actual [/I]Magic. All are perfectly reasonable approaches. There are as many styles of D&D and approaches to the game as there are tables that D&D is played on. The desire for running a non-magic game is hardly an unheard of approach. It's certainly something that seems reasonable for an edition meant to be inclusive. A Warlord class facilitates that kind of play, along with bringing other desired aspects of which I mentioned before. You're new to the Warlord conversations here at ENWorld...Yes? Warlords don't cause wounds to close or bones to knit together using words. Mostly, it's those that want to discredit the concept of a Warlord that say this, and not fans of the Warlord. First, D&D Hit Points don't express as "broken bones." They don't even express as "open wounds." D&D Hit Points are vague - on purpose - and they constitute more than just meat, as per the rules definition of Hit Points (physical durability, mental durability, luck and will to live). Things like broken bones or other obviously debilitating injuries would be the realm of critical hits and lingering wounds. Lingering wounds are an optional aspect of the game. The standard D&D rules do not include effects for broken bones or anything else - there is no debilitating effect of Hit Point loss until one hits zero. D&D Hit Points are not that granular. However, if one used Lingering Wounds or Specific Wounds (broken bones, etc.) in a game, and applied penalties based on those, I think such wounds should require some kind of special treatment - and No, Warlord Inspiration wouldn't necessarily help (depending on the type of wound). Second, Inspiration can, physiologically, improve one's physical condition. It's very rare and very extraordinary, but extraordinary is what the game is all about (as you said;)). An inspirational exhortation triggers a sympathetic nervous system response. That response generates a surge of adrenaline, endorphins, serotonin and dopamine. This causes pain mitigation (physical and mental durability), an increase in blood pressure - allowing the body to regain homeostasis (physical durability), makes one feel more optimistic (mental durability, will to live), and promotes blood clotting (physical durability). Yes, the actual "cuts" may still exist, but there effect has largely been neutralized. That is Hit Point recovery. But honestly, the real-world explanation shouldn't be necessary. Warlord inspirational hit point recovery is consistent with the game's definition of Hit Points - and that's all that should matter. Also, one can't make an argument that Inspirational Recovery is illogical or doesn't make sense, when one also accepts that simply sleeping 8 hours completely heals a person of all wounds. One thing about actually serving in the military, rather than just participating in an academic discussion or a detached simulation, is that I've been immersed in a culture where Leadership is a very real, tangible, and omnipresent thing. Leadership is not limited to just those who are in charge, and Leadership does not require one to be in charge. Leadership is a quality that anyone can possess, but it must be cultivated. Leadership requires above all things, Conscientiousness. Exercising leadership does not require telling people what to do, just as following doesn't necessarily mean subordinate. In a really good team, everybody is a Leader - which is why the Military teaches and cultivates Leadership throughout every stage of one's career - regardless of rank. From moment to moment, one might find themselves following or leading as the situation dictates. People don't only follow leaders because they have to, they most often do it because it's mutually beneficial. Leadership can be exercised through advice as well as orders - but most often displayed through example. What you're talking about is Authority, not Leadership. It really helps to differentiate between the two concepts. In the game, I'd absolutely have a problem with another character having authority over my character. That is not what a Warlord does. [/QUOTE]
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I don't actually get the opposition for the warlord... or rather the opposition to the concept.
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