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<blockquote data-quote="Crazy Jerome" data-source="post: 5699160" data-attributes="member: 54877">I read the whole thread, and I'm kind of surprised that this wasn't picked up, since here we are many posts later, and it is still the only &quot;mechanics&quot; area criticism of surges that I saw.&nbsp;Especially since hit points have always been primarily a narrative pacing convention.&nbsp; Hit point pacing has been compared to the last scene in Robin and Marion, where an older Robin Hood, played by Sean Connery, fights the Sherriff of Nottingham.&nbsp; He kills the Sherriff, then crawls off to die of his wounds--though the nuns &quot;bleeding&quot; him as a cure is ambiguous in the orginal source material, and deliberately played as such in the movie.&nbsp; At least one player in Gygax's original games has specifically cited that scene as the best explanation of hit points in film.&nbsp;As near as I can tell, the other objections to surges have been in the same category as objections to hit points:&nbsp; They don't produce the kind of pacing that I want.&nbsp; Nothing wrong with that.&nbsp; On the contrary, if someone don't get the kind of pacing they want in combat, it is highly unlikely that they could like the results.&nbsp; But this is an objection to the design ethos of 4E, not the mechanics of surges.&nbsp; (And in fairness, many people have recognized that, both pro and con.)&nbsp;Tom's objection above is outside that range, because while it accepts that narrative pacing is important, it is relating the effects of surges in particular to the &quot;micro&quot; pacing of combat, rather than the overall pacing of the fight.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Crazy Jerome, post: 5699160, member: 54877"] I read the whole thread, and I'm kind of surprised that this wasn't picked up, since here we are many posts later, and it is still the only "mechanics" area criticism of surges that I saw. Especially since hit points have always been primarily a narrative pacing convention. Hit point pacing has been compared to the last scene in Robin and Marion, where an older Robin Hood, played by Sean Connery, fights the Sherriff of Nottingham. He kills the Sherriff, then crawls off to die of his wounds--though the nuns "bleeding" him as a cure is ambiguous in the orginal source material, and deliberately played as such in the movie. At least one player in Gygax's original games has specifically cited that scene as the best explanation of hit points in film. As near as I can tell, the other objections to surges have been in the same category as objections to hit points: They don't produce the kind of pacing that I want. Nothing wrong with that. On the contrary, if someone don't get the kind of pacing they want in combat, it is highly unlikely that they could like the results. But this is an objection to the design ethos of 4E, not the mechanics of surges. (And in fairness, many people have recognized that, both pro and con.) Tom's objection above is outside that range, because while it accepts that narrative pacing is important, it is relating the effects of surges in particular to the "micro" pacing of combat, rather than the overall pacing of the fight. [/QUOTE]

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