Menu
News
All News
Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
Pathfinder
Starfinder
Warhammer
2d20 System
Year Zero Engine
Industry News
Reviews
Dragon Reflections
White Dwarf Reflections
Columns
Weekly Digests
Weekly News Digest
Freebies, Sales & Bundles
RPG Print News
RPG Crowdfunding News
Game Content
ENterplanetary DimENsions
Mythological Figures
Opinion
Worlds of Design
Peregrine's Nest
RPG Evolution
Other Columns
From the Freelancing Frontline
Monster ENcyclopedia
WotC/TSR Alumni Look Back
4 Hours w/RSD (Ryan Dancey)
The Road to 3E (Jonathan Tweet)
Greenwood's Realms (Ed Greenwood)
Drawmij's TSR (Jim Ward)
Community
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Resources
Wiki
Pages
Latest activity
Media
New media
New comments
Search media
Downloads
Latest reviews
Search resources
EN Publishing
Store
EN5ider
Adventures in ZEITGEIST
Awfully Cheerful Engine
What's OLD is NEW
Judge Dredd & The Worlds Of 2000AD
War of the Burning Sky
Level Up: Advanced 5E
Events & Releases
Upcoming Events
Private Events
Featured Events
Socials!
EN Publishing
Twitter
BlueSky
Facebook
Instagram
EN World
BlueSky
YouTube
Facebook
Twitter
Twitch
Podcast
Features
Top 5 RPGs Compiled Charts 2004-Present
Adventure Game Industry Market Research Summary (RPGs) V1.0
Ryan Dancey: Acquiring TSR
Q&A With Gary Gygax
D&D Rules FAQs
TSR, WotC, & Paizo: A Comparative History
D&D Pronunciation Guide
Million Dollar TTRPG Kickstarters
Tabletop RPG Podcast Hall of Fame
Eric Noah's Unofficial D&D 3rd Edition News
D&D in the Mainstream
D&D & RPG History
About Morrus
Log in
Register
What's new
Search
Search
Search titles only
By:
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
Upgrade your account to a Community Supporter account and remove most of the site ads.
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*TTRPGs General
I don't get what you'all are saying
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="Dannyalcatraz" data-source="post: 4289094" data-attributes="member: 19675"><p>As a DM and a player, 4Ed has me feeling handcuffed.</p><p></p><p>For me, it boils down to these major things:</p><p></p><p>1) The 4Ed rules- particularly the multiclassing rules- don't support the way I've been designing my D&D PCs for 30 years. As a player, this vexes me greatly- my taste has been voided by game mechanics.</p><p></p><p>2) Some of the changes to crunch and fluff seem arbitrary to me, and are not obviously an improvement over their counterparts in previous editions.</p><p></p><p>3) Some of the rules changes treat the player or DM like an idiot, or are utterly nonsensical. I'm not talking about the rules that simplify or streamline mechanics. I'm talking about things like the magic adjustment charts for monsters and NPCs. If I, as DM, give an opponent a +3 weapon, I mean for it to give that foe a +3 bonus, not something adjusted down because the creature is particularly powerful. If I wanted to give that foe a lesser bonus than +3, I would have done so.</p><p></p><p>4) Some of the rules I'd like to use as a DM (since I've been using them for 25+ years) are simply absent, like rules for creating unique magic items.</p><p></p><p>5) 4E is not backwards compatible. I play in several campaigns, one of which has lasted 10+ years, another which has lasted 20+ years. Because of the rules changes, some PCs are simply not creatable, meaning that to update those games to 4Ed would require retconning or waiting until some future date uncertain for a product which may never come. Understandably, I and the other players aren't too keen on ditching established campaigns merely to jump into the new system, especially with its known warts and all.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Dannyalcatraz, post: 4289094, member: 19675"] As a DM and a player, 4Ed has me feeling handcuffed. For me, it boils down to these major things: 1) The 4Ed rules- particularly the multiclassing rules- don't support the way I've been designing my D&D PCs for 30 years. As a player, this vexes me greatly- my taste has been voided by game mechanics. 2) Some of the changes to crunch and fluff seem arbitrary to me, and are not obviously an improvement over their counterparts in previous editions. 3) Some of the rules changes treat the player or DM like an idiot, or are utterly nonsensical. I'm not talking about the rules that simplify or streamline mechanics. I'm talking about things like the magic adjustment charts for monsters and NPCs. If I, as DM, give an opponent a +3 weapon, I mean for it to give that foe a +3 bonus, not something adjusted down because the creature is particularly powerful. If I wanted to give that foe a lesser bonus than +3, I would have done so. 4) Some of the rules I'd like to use as a DM (since I've been using them for 25+ years) are simply absent, like rules for creating unique magic items. 5) 4E is not backwards compatible. I play in several campaigns, one of which has lasted 10+ years, another which has lasted 20+ years. Because of the rules changes, some PCs are simply not creatable, meaning that to update those games to 4Ed would require retconning or waiting until some future date uncertain for a product which may never come. Understandably, I and the other players aren't too keen on ditching established campaigns merely to jump into the new system, especially with its known warts and all. [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*TTRPGs General
I don't get what you'all are saying
Top