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<blockquote data-quote="Mark Chance" data-source="post: 4309835" data-attributes="member: 2795">Since it wasn't a problem for a character to do this is OD&amp;D, 1E, 2E, 3E, or 3.5E, I'm not sure what the point of 4E's predicate is. For example:Is it seriously your contention that someone playing the above-described half-orc cannot participate &quot;in the non-combat portions of gaming session&quot;? Is there some actual reason that a player whose character has only ranks in Jump is somehow not allowed to roleplay or problem-solve?Once again, 4E is touted as fixing a problem that isn't really a problem. After all, I roleplayed problem-solving barbarians in 1E long before anyone had any ranks in any skills.What you seem to be describing isn't a problem with a game system. It's a player problem. It's the player who looks at his character sheet, doesn't see a skill bonus for &quot;roleplaying&quot; or &quot;problem-solving&quot; and therefore assumes his character can't be used to do those things.Changing game mechanics to cure player myopia might be a good idea, but it is hardly making the game mechanics &quot;completely invisible in the game world.&quot;</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Mark Chance, post: 4309835, member: 2795"] Since it wasn't a problem for a character to do this is OD&D, 1E, 2E, 3E, or 3.5E, I'm not sure what the point of 4E's predicate is. For example: Is it seriously your contention that someone playing the above-described half-orc cannot participate "in the non-combat portions of gaming session"? Is there some actual reason that a player whose character has only ranks in Jump is somehow not allowed to roleplay or problem-solve? Once again, 4E is touted as fixing a problem that isn't really a problem. After all, I roleplayed problem-solving barbarians in 1E long before anyone had any ranks in any skills. What you seem to be describing isn't a problem with a game system. It's a player problem. It's the player who looks at his character sheet, doesn't see a skill bonus for "roleplaying" or "problem-solving" and therefore assumes his character can't be used to do those things. Changing game mechanics to cure player myopia might be a good idea, but it is hardly making the game mechanics "completely invisible in the game world." [/QUOTE]

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