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Message: <blockquote data-quote="reapersaurus" data-source="post: 1321181" data-attributes="member: 1194">Serge - good post - that's really the first post I can remember that contains any criticisms other than "It sucked" or "It SHOULD have done things the way I thought it should be done."Even if someone has a diametrically opposing opinion, as long as they can back it up with more than just personal issues with a work (i.e. "it sucked hard"), than that's worth reading.What does "allowed" mean?If you think that they are going to be yanked off the board by a Mod - no.But most posters on ENWorld (especially in this Fantasy forum) (I hope) tend to look down on posts which contain nothing but "It sucked."Posts like that are indicative more of the poster's inability to form a cohesive opinion and write intelligently, than of the piece he's critiquing.If "It sucked" posts (especially to start a thread) were the norm here, we'd would be no better than IMDB's forums. <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f644.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":rolleyes:" title="Roll eyes    :rolleyes:"  data-smilie="11"data-shortname=":rolleyes:" />And just for conversation, I don't believe that spoilers are a consideration for a film that's already been released on home video/DVD. I just don't buy that you started a new thread out of considerateness for people who would read an "I just saw Underworld" thread and not expect spoilers.Sarcasm, on the other hand, is alive and well.At least you actually detailed some of the things you didn't like about the film this time....About those:a) It is not realistically possible to have a werewolf/vampire movie where they actually fight using powers for under $20 million like this movie was made with.People can SAY "it would have been better if they showed vampires busting out claws and teeth and super-powers, and have werewolves going all feral and <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" /><img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" /><img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" /><img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" />, but let's be realistic (since we live in the real world): they couldn't make that film, so we got what we got - either you understand that as a realistic fantasy fan, or you don't.To put Underworld up against some fantasy movie bar that doesn't exist (vampire/werewolf War movie that USES supernatural powers) is a tad .... pie-in-the-skyish to me.b) I am really sick of people dismissing entire films (even ones in completely different genres) just because of superficial resemblances.Underwolrd is almost nothing like the MAtrix.If you'd like me to point out the myriad of details that are vastly different betwen the films, I could, but it would be a waste of time, and only telling people what they already know : there are only superficial similarities between the films, mainly with one lead character wearing black leather/latex and shooting guns, and a slow-mo action effect or 2.Are people ever going to let go of that comparison?20 years from now, when there's a slo-mo effect of a gun being fired, will people dismiss that movie because The MAtrix used it in 1999?Wake up - it's part of the ouvre of action film conventions now.c) Complaining about acting is a canard - everyone has completely different tastes there, and without explaining how/why it's bad, it means nothing.If I say that I thought the acting was great across the board (excepting Kraven), does that adequately counter your "argument"?If you detailed examples of what you saw as bad acting (excepting Kraven), I'd be all ears, and more respectful of an opinion based on something we can sink our teeth into in an internet discussion (pun intended). d) I simply don't agree with your "focus on minor details, neglect major details" point. I never noticed the reflection detail taking center stage, and I grokked the major details when they chose to reveal them.In fact, I thought it was quite admirable, effective, and refreshing the way they doled out the major plot details of Lucien's and Selene's backstorys.e) I'll grant the point about the werewolves and vamps both using super-bullets in the final battle, yet them not showing them except for in Kraven's gun.The movie's not perfect.f) The werewolves were losing because up until that exact point of history in the war, they were at a technological disadvantage. It was established in the film (mnaybe you missed it) that the vamps had been already using silver bullets. Further, Selene herself narrated in the intro that they were being very successful ("too successful") at wiping out werewolves (using this method).The film chose to take that section of the war to film - when technology brought the conflict to a head, and circumstances/plotting caused the centuries of machinations to come to fruition/resolution.g) Yep - you have to accept that the werewolf force was strong enough IN A PLANNED AMBUSH YEARS IN THE MAKING to take out even an elder.... offscreen, yes.[troll] I don't hear people complaining about Tolkein dealing with major plot elements offscreen...[/troll]h) Ya, Selene bought the story Viktor told her.There are myriad of reasons for this (human shock and need for explanation of tragedy, supernatural powers of Viktor convincing her, the long effect time has on the memory, immersion in a society making their beliefs more persuasive to the individual, etc, etc).That's a weak complaint, and you can ask questions like that of almost every film where a character was wrong about something.i) Complaining about names used in a vampire/werewolf gothic film is like complaining about names used in a Roman-period movie.You obviously didn't buy into the whole concept of the film - why did you bother seeing it, if your complaints are this based on your inability to accept the premise/genre?</blockquote>

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