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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Imaro" data-source="post: 6374864" data-attributes="member: 48965">It means you could be reading the rules in the most pedantic way due to the fact that you're not particularly enamored with 5e and because it helps you to make your case against 5e's clarity... when numerous other posters including @<a href="http://www.enworld.org/forum/member.php?u=87792" target="_blank">Neonchameleon</a> don't seem to be having all these hang ups with the stealth rules that you do. Really... I guess in total isolation that would be the case, which is exactly why I brought up context in my earlier post (something you didn't really address in any of your replies).  The section you are quoting from also states..."...so if you come out of hiding and approach a creature it usually sees you.  However under certain circumstances, the Dungeon Master might allowyou to stay hidden as you approach a creature that is distracted, allowing you to gain an attack before you are seen....""What Can You See?  One of the main factors in determining whether you can find a hidden creature or object is how well you can see in an area, which might be lightly or heavily obscured, as explained in chapter 8."So from the first quote we see that just because a creature has the ability to see you... doesn't necessarily mean it auto-sees you and cancels your hidden state.  In some circumstances the DM can make a judgement call about it.  We also see from the second quote that the vision portion of stealth is addressed in chapter 8...It's only possible if you read that and only that sentence with no context... How about we step back from the picture and try taking it all in as a whole?No I'm saying the NPC disintegrating that wall does not mean you are automatically revealed.  Please again refer to the sentences I quoted and chapter 8.  Does the DM feel that there are any circumstances that would allow you to stay hidden and possibly attack the NPC with advantage? What's the lighting?  What was the fictional positioning used to hide (am I using that correctly??)... Yes but certain visual cues ending the status is not the same as pronouncing a blanket statement that a creature cannot remain hidden if he/she can be seen... the game is saying the lighting conditions as well as the DM should be deciding if that's the case through examining the fictional environment and actions.Is it?  I have a different understanding of the ability than @<a href="http://www.enworld.org/forum/member.php?u=39815" target="_blank">occam</a> has... one of us could be wrong but determining whether it is or isn't because the rules are clear... well I'll wait to see what @<a href="http://www.enworld.org/forum/member.php?u=39815" target="_blank">occam</a> says after reading my own thoughts on it and reply then.  He may be able to convince me that I am mistaken... or maybe I'll convince him he is.</blockquote>

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