Menu
News
All News
Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
Pathfinder
Starfinder
Warhammer
2d20 System
Year Zero Engine
Industry News
Reviews
Dragon Reflections
Columns
Weekly Digests
Weekly News Digest
Freebies, Sales & Bundles
RPG Print News
RPG Crowdfunding News
Game Content
ENterplanetary DimENsions
Mythological Figures
Opinion
Worlds of Design
Peregrine's Next
RPG Evolution
Other Columns
From the Freelancing Frontline
Monster ENcyclopedia
WotC/TSR Alumni Look Back
4 Hours w/RSD (Ryan Dancey)
The Road to 3E (Jonathan Tweet)
Greenwood's Realms (Ed Greenwood)
Drawmij's TSR (Jim Ward)
Community
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Resources
Wiki
Pages
Latest activity
Media
New media
New comments
Search media
Downloads
Latest reviews
Search resources
EN Publishing
Store
EN5ider
Adventures in ZEITGEIST
Awfully Cheerful Engine
What's OLD is NEW
Judge Dredd & The Worlds Of 2000AD
War of the Burning Sky
Level Up: Advanced 5E
Events & Releases
Upcoming Events
Private Events
Featured Events
Socials!
Twitch
YouTube
Facebook (EN Publishing)
Facebook (EN World)
Twitter
Instagram
TikTok
Podcast
Features
Top 5 RPGs Compiled Charts 2004-Present
Adventure Game Industry Market Research Summary (RPGs) V1.0
Ryan Dancey: Acquiring TSR
Q&A With Gary Gygax
D&D Rules FAQs
TSR, WotC, & Paizo: A Comparative History
D&D Pronunciation Guide
Million Dollar TTRPG Kickstarters
Tabletop RPG Podcast Hall of Fame
Eric Noah's Unofficial D&D 3rd Edition News
D&D in the Mainstream
D&D & RPG History
About Morrus
Log in
Register
What's new
Search
Search
Search titles only
By:
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Dungeons & Dragons
I gave up--Here's a Warrior-Mage base class
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="Matthan" data-source="post: 7140044" data-attributes="member: 20005"><p>A few caveats before I comment:</p><p></p><p>I’m not great at breaking the game. Some people can intuitively see unintended combos, but when it comes to spell casters, the range of spells available make that difficult for me to do. </p><p></p><p>I also haven’t run any numbers for my suggestions. Take most of this as just brainstorming.</p><p></p><p>I’m also only commenting on the things that jumped out to me.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>I think the issue that you’re running into here isn’t a math one. It’s a system issue. The Core rules have walled off third and fourth attacks for Fighters. Breaking that assumption before WotC does it will create a knee-jerk response of unbalanced (whether or not the math supports it). You’ll see the same response to any homebrew that allows for multiple concentration spells. Personally, if I were you, I would look into impacting their damage output differently perhaps with something similar to the Cleric’s Divine Strike ability (flavored as the Fighter-Mage channeling magic through their weapons) and forego extra attacks entirely. That would widen the gap between this class and the Eldritch Knight/Valor Bard. You’re already getting a lot of flexibility by having full access to the Wizard spell list (like Haste). Giving up the flexibility of a second or third attack while maintaining DPR might be a good solution to thread the needle here.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>I think this is probably fine.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Spitballing here without any real math behind me, but I wonder if you could craft a feature that either boosted the cantrip or the weapon attack portion of War Magic instead of just taking the improved feature as is. I have not run any numbers, but I would look for opportunities to make this class feel more like its own expression of the concept than just meshing existing features (which, to be fair, is what you stated that you wanted to do so grain of salt and all that). Maybe expanding a single target to two targets or just a damage increase (add +Int to damage or similar). Just an idea for you to consider.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>This is just me, but I don’t know why this needs to be nerfed. Being able to reroll one failed Str or Wis save per long rest and having to take the roll does not strike me as game breaking. I’m not great at breaking the game though so maybe someone sees something I don’t. It’s already limited from the Fighter ability (Indomitable) in type (fighters can pick any save) and amount (fighters get more saves). I don’t think you need to split up Str and Wis. </p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>I’m not sure what the concern is for Grim Harvest. At best, you’re getting back 9 HP if you kill someone with a 9th level Necromancy spell (which may not even exist in the game yet). Again, I’m not great at seeing broken combos, but I can’t imagine that breaking anything. Maybe your concern is that it’s not strong enough? If you really want to differentiate it and possibly let it add more HP more in line with the original feature, consider letting it grant temporary HP instead of actual HP. Since temporary HP don’t stack, the fighter-mage couldn’t really heal himself effectively. He would just be creating a small buffer.</p><p></p><p>There are a few things that I would look into that might be beyond your stated scope of design. </p><p></p><p>I would look at stealing from the War Caster feat for class abilities. A lot of people don’t like using feats for homebrew abilities, but a Fighter-Mage that cannot innately use a sword and shield while casting spells feels like it misses the mark to me. Perhaps something that lets you use your weapon as a spell focus as well? You could limit it to one weapon that you are bonded to, but forego the Eldritch Knight perks (summoning, no disarming, and more than one weapon). </p><p></p><p>Taking away Ritual Caster could be helpful as balance.</p><p></p><p>Hope some of that is helpful. Good luck with it!</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Matthan, post: 7140044, member: 20005"] A few caveats before I comment: I’m not great at breaking the game. Some people can intuitively see unintended combos, but when it comes to spell casters, the range of spells available make that difficult for me to do. I also haven’t run any numbers for my suggestions. Take most of this as just brainstorming. I’m also only commenting on the things that jumped out to me. I think the issue that you’re running into here isn’t a math one. It’s a system issue. The Core rules have walled off third and fourth attacks for Fighters. Breaking that assumption before WotC does it will create a knee-jerk response of unbalanced (whether or not the math supports it). You’ll see the same response to any homebrew that allows for multiple concentration spells. Personally, if I were you, I would look into impacting their damage output differently perhaps with something similar to the Cleric’s Divine Strike ability (flavored as the Fighter-Mage channeling magic through their weapons) and forego extra attacks entirely. That would widen the gap between this class and the Eldritch Knight/Valor Bard. You’re already getting a lot of flexibility by having full access to the Wizard spell list (like Haste). Giving up the flexibility of a second or third attack while maintaining DPR might be a good solution to thread the needle here. I think this is probably fine. Spitballing here without any real math behind me, but I wonder if you could craft a feature that either boosted the cantrip or the weapon attack portion of War Magic instead of just taking the improved feature as is. I have not run any numbers, but I would look for opportunities to make this class feel more like its own expression of the concept than just meshing existing features (which, to be fair, is what you stated that you wanted to do so grain of salt and all that). Maybe expanding a single target to two targets or just a damage increase (add +Int to damage or similar). Just an idea for you to consider. This is just me, but I don’t know why this needs to be nerfed. Being able to reroll one failed Str or Wis save per long rest and having to take the roll does not strike me as game breaking. I’m not great at breaking the game though so maybe someone sees something I don’t. It’s already limited from the Fighter ability (Indomitable) in type (fighters can pick any save) and amount (fighters get more saves). I don’t think you need to split up Str and Wis. I’m not sure what the concern is for Grim Harvest. At best, you’re getting back 9 HP if you kill someone with a 9th level Necromancy spell (which may not even exist in the game yet). Again, I’m not great at seeing broken combos, but I can’t imagine that breaking anything. Maybe your concern is that it’s not strong enough? If you really want to differentiate it and possibly let it add more HP more in line with the original feature, consider letting it grant temporary HP instead of actual HP. Since temporary HP don’t stack, the fighter-mage couldn’t really heal himself effectively. He would just be creating a small buffer. There are a few things that I would look into that might be beyond your stated scope of design. I would look at stealing from the War Caster feat for class abilities. A lot of people don’t like using feats for homebrew abilities, but a Fighter-Mage that cannot innately use a sword and shield while casting spells feels like it misses the mark to me. Perhaps something that lets you use your weapon as a spell focus as well? You could limit it to one weapon that you are bonded to, but forego the Eldritch Knight perks (summoning, no disarming, and more than one weapon). Taking away Ritual Caster could be helpful as balance. Hope some of that is helpful. Good luck with it! [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Dungeons & Dragons
I gave up--Here's a Warrior-Mage base class
Top