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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Ariosto" data-source="post: 4981634" data-attributes="member: 80487">I don't recall having used that phrase at all, and I am certainly not dismissive of the rules-heavier game any more than someone who prefers it instead is dismissive of the rules-lighter game. The game of builds, and the game of manipulating abstract factors (rather than perceived phenomena) in encounters, is a fine kind of game.It is one I often enjoy, more (but not exclusively) in war games. Appreciating it -- or any one of many other possible features -- in some RPGs does not make it incumbent upon me to want it in every RPG. I do not find my D&D game improved by the addition, any more than I would consider my RuneQuest game better for dumping skill ratings or adding a character-class system.I am not in quest of a "Platonic ideal system" at all, much less bent on forcing D&D into such a mold.Frisbees, hula hoops and roller skates are dandy. In my opinion, the lack of them does not impoverish the game of baseball.The representation, the mechanical model, of the imagined world is no more necessarily something with which to encumber players than is the program code of a computer game. If you prefer to play by typing and compiling, then have your fun. What's the bug up your butt about other people preferring just to play their "first person shooter" in the first person, by just pointing and shooting?</blockquote>