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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Upper_Krust" data-source="post: 2553746" data-attributes="member: 326">Hey Aluvial mate! <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" /> Any group of mid CR monsters can be used effectively against low-epic PCs. You just need to set up the situation to give them a direct advantage. The giant leader could have maximum hit points.  <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f600.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":D" title="Big grin    :D"  data-smilie="8"data-shortname=":D" /> Remember also that Mountain Giants have a Summon Giant ability. So you could easily counter their elementals by bringing in another group of giants from the rear.Heres what to do. Get a stopwatch, or even better, a 60 or 90 second egg-timer.In turn give each player 'until the sands run out' to tell you exactly what they are going to do on their turn. If the player starts to dither, mumble, stall or not explain themselves sufficiently, then treat them as if Dazed for that round.Be adamant in your policing of this rule. Never give epic players an even break. Another idea to speed up play. Use average damage for monsters (Stone Giant 21 damage, Mountain Giant 42 damage). Still roll a few dice behind the DMs screen, but just take a rough average.  I agree, see my above suggestion about timing them on their decisions. Well, a few things to remember are:1) Mountain Giants are not really CR 26 in the traditional sense, probably more akin to CR 20. If you wanted them to be a fairly tough encounter for your PCs I would have suggested 6 mountain giants (and 12 stone giants), or 4 mountain giants (and 8 stone giants) if you wanted it to be a typical encounter for your PCs.2) Your party are double the standard size for a group, which means you have to double the number of opponents, or alternately increase the CR of opponents. Well remember that during the parties stay in the extradimensional space the giants could have used their summon giant ability.You could have the giants bring down the roof of the cave onto the PCs and treat it as an Earthquake spell. The giants could have rigged the ceiling to collapse, so they would know where to stand for minimal damage - handy since you say they are pegged back. Even if the giants take some of the damage they won't be pinned beneath the rubble, unlike the PCs.Check pages 66-67 of the DMG 3.5 for details on cave-ins.At this point the giants can flee (if they are severely weakened) or beat on the PCs, who will be pinned for a minimum of 1 round, likely more. This is where you need to wake them up to the fact that at epic levels, complacency means death.Pull no punches. Have the giants cave-in the roof. Then have the summoned giant reinforcements appear at the rear of the chamber (twelve more stone giants). Have the giants beat on the trapped PCs (who need to make a DC 25 strength check to free themselves - and thats a full round action). The giants will be +4 to hit the trapped PCs, the PCs will not be able to benefit from dexterity either. All damage on pinned PCs should be doubled because it is effectively crushing damage!  Not just yet. I would be interested to hear how they dealt with the cave-in scenario.Also, regarding a CR 30 monster, if you are just using flat character levels you are likely to get minced by the PCs.Is that Imix, or Ogremoch...or something like that? I haven't played RttToEE.I have given a few ideas above, I hope they are at least some help to you.</blockquote>

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