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I Have A Problem With 3E
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<blockquote data-quote="theredrobedwizard" data-source="post: 3220271" data-attributes="member: 21340"><p>Que? I'm so very confused by this statement. This is why they have blanks on the character sheet labeled "Attack Bonus" listed next to a specific weapon. There should never be a time when the player is asking that unless they've got a buff from another player and can't do simple addition.</p><p></p><p>Also, for "complicated" characters like Fighters with Power Attack, make a page of "typical Power Attacks"; like this.</p><p></p><p>Longsword - Attack +7 - Damage 1d8+3 - Critical 19-20/x2</p><p>Longsword with half Power Attack - Attack +5 - Damage 1d8+5 - Critical 19-20/x2</p><p>Longsword with full Power Attack - Attack +3 - Damage 1d8+7 - Critical 19-20/x2</p><p></p><p>How hard is that, really?</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Oh, you can still make judgment calls, but the way 3e is set up, you don't have to make judgment calls for things like Power Attack or Tumble. Less judgment calls *required* is a good thing. Feel free to make your own calls, just don't force them all on newbie DMs.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>I'm sorry if it seems like I'm calling you out or anything; I'm really not. I'm sure you're a stand-up bloke (or bloke-ette), just felt the need to respond.</p><p></p><p>Back to the OP.</p><p></p><p>1) Mutliclassing - I don't usually agree with The Gneech about things (I'm honestly not sure why, though), but his point about d20 Modern has merit. I don't like Pre-d20 D&D simply because it's damned near impossible for a character to say "Ya know, this whole thievery thing isn't working out too well for me; I'm going to go train to be a more straightforward warrior."</p><p></p><p>2) Free Metamagic - A lot of the other posters have hit this on the head, but the "free" metamagic items aren't really free. It's like complaining that a magical sword gives the Fighter a better chance to hit. If anything, they're a welcome addition for spellcasters, whom normally don't get much benefit out of non-spellbook or stat-boost items treasure.</p><p></p><p>3) Synergy - Is unlimited healing really *that* big an issue? Especially when it comes with the high price of Tomb-Tainted Soul? Heck, it even makes flavor-sense to take that feat; you're a Dread <strong>Necromancer</strong>, shouldn't your soul be Tomb-Tainted if all you do is galavant around with the undead? Be that as it may, there's still the risk of some NPC healer coming across your unconscious body and trying to cast Cure Light Wounds to bring you around. Died by Cure Light Wounds, how embarrassing is that?</p><p></p><p>4) Two-Handed Weapons - Beyond animated shields, most THW types have between 2 and 4 less AC than the Sword and Board type. Honestly, I think they're all balanced if you incorporate the PHB2; the SaB gets a lot of love in there. </p><p></p><p>TWF - More attacks that do average damage, less defense.</p><p>THW - Bigger attacks, less defense.</p><p>SaB - Less attacks, more defense.</p><p></p><p>I really don't see what the problem with that formula is. I've had just as many SaB fighters as I have THW types. Only one TWF person ever, simply because most players in my group don't want to roll 14 attacks on a full attack.</p><p></p><p>5) Balancing per Encounter instead of Per Day - Again I say, "What?". I mean, I get the issue of "fight for 10 minutes, then rest all day", but that just seems to be the logical way of doing it. If I could get all of my work done in 10 minutes, then could take the rest of the day off, I'm pretty sure I would. It's not heroic, sure, but it's smart. Same with the Grimlock argument from before. </p><p></p><p>Sure, every once in a while, it's fun to do one of those "lets see how long we can keep going without resting" things. In most cases, though, that just leads to TPKs; and that's something I want to avoid. D&D to me is a casual environment where friends get together and have fun.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Sure, four 1st level heroes beating up a lone grimlock isn't heroic; unless that Grimlock leapt out and attacked them, using its heightened senses to hide before the PCs noticed it. Especially if it leapt out and incapacitated the group's Wizard. Heroism is subjective; I see it as living in a world where seemingly every bad thing in existence wants you dead. </p><p></p><p>[nerd rage] And frankly, the CR system *is* a good way for new DMs to judge encounters, until they get a better handle on what their player characters can do. It's not a kludge, it's a helping hand. I'm sure you, in your infinite wisdom, can easily spot exactly how an encounter is going to go down, but some DMs are new, and need things like CR to help them out. It may not be elegant, but it works for what it was intended.[/nerd rage]</p><p></p><p>6) Neverending Buffs - These are much better than "1 minute per level" and the like buffs, in that they actually encourage people to go out and adventure all day. Actually, lets scrap them and just have Marshal/Dragon Shaman/Bard-like aura effects that are always on. Much easier and more thematic.</p><p></p><p>7) Combat Expertise / Power Attack - If options are a bad thing, I don't want to be good. As noted way back up at the top of this ranting, if players are having a hard time grasping the (rather simplistic) rules for Combat Expertise and/or Power Attack, they should either make up a cheat sheet or play something simpler.</p><p></p><p>8) Point Buy - In the real world, things aren't fair. In D&D, I expect everyone to at least start on something resembling equal footing. </p><p></p><p>9) Rerolls - As I'm sure someone pointed out before, it's called the Luck domain. It makes sense that it'll make you, oh I don't know, Lucky? Crimeny. Rerolls aren't bad, it's that they appearantly take all the fun out of it for killer DMs. Good.</p><p></p><p>10) Magic Item Creation - Again, XP = life-energy/soul/whatever. You're giving up part of your soul to make that magic item. That's pretty much how it worked in LotR and most fantasy type stuff I've read.</p><p></p><p>Sorry for all the nerd rage earlier, but it's one of those days. It's a sore point for me when people say "This is what I don't like about 3e, but it doesn't matter because all I play is OD&D/1st Ed/2nd Ed, because they're far superior blah blah blah blah." </p><p></p><p>If you're really that enamored with ye olde D&D, please, PLEASE stop complaining about "us kids today" with our newfangled "feats and skills and multiclassing".</p><p></p><p>They're *different games*, stop trying to compare them.</p><p></p><p>-TRRW</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="theredrobedwizard, post: 3220271, member: 21340"] Que? I'm so very confused by this statement. This is why they have blanks on the character sheet labeled "Attack Bonus" listed next to a specific weapon. There should never be a time when the player is asking that unless they've got a buff from another player and can't do simple addition. Also, for "complicated" characters like Fighters with Power Attack, make a page of "typical Power Attacks"; like this. Longsword - Attack +7 - Damage 1d8+3 - Critical 19-20/x2 Longsword with half Power Attack - Attack +5 - Damage 1d8+5 - Critical 19-20/x2 Longsword with full Power Attack - Attack +3 - Damage 1d8+7 - Critical 19-20/x2 How hard is that, really? Oh, you can still make judgment calls, but the way 3e is set up, you don't have to make judgment calls for things like Power Attack or Tumble. Less judgment calls *required* is a good thing. Feel free to make your own calls, just don't force them all on newbie DMs. I'm sorry if it seems like I'm calling you out or anything; I'm really not. I'm sure you're a stand-up bloke (or bloke-ette), just felt the need to respond. Back to the OP. 1) Mutliclassing - I don't usually agree with The Gneech about things (I'm honestly not sure why, though), but his point about d20 Modern has merit. I don't like Pre-d20 D&D simply because it's damned near impossible for a character to say "Ya know, this whole thievery thing isn't working out too well for me; I'm going to go train to be a more straightforward warrior." 2) Free Metamagic - A lot of the other posters have hit this on the head, but the "free" metamagic items aren't really free. It's like complaining that a magical sword gives the Fighter a better chance to hit. If anything, they're a welcome addition for spellcasters, whom normally don't get much benefit out of non-spellbook or stat-boost items treasure. 3) Synergy - Is unlimited healing really *that* big an issue? Especially when it comes with the high price of Tomb-Tainted Soul? Heck, it even makes flavor-sense to take that feat; you're a Dread [b]Necromancer[/b], shouldn't your soul be Tomb-Tainted if all you do is galavant around with the undead? Be that as it may, there's still the risk of some NPC healer coming across your unconscious body and trying to cast Cure Light Wounds to bring you around. Died by Cure Light Wounds, how embarrassing is that? 4) Two-Handed Weapons - Beyond animated shields, most THW types have between 2 and 4 less AC than the Sword and Board type. Honestly, I think they're all balanced if you incorporate the PHB2; the SaB gets a lot of love in there. TWF - More attacks that do average damage, less defense. THW - Bigger attacks, less defense. SaB - Less attacks, more defense. I really don't see what the problem with that formula is. I've had just as many SaB fighters as I have THW types. Only one TWF person ever, simply because most players in my group don't want to roll 14 attacks on a full attack. 5) Balancing per Encounter instead of Per Day - Again I say, "What?". I mean, I get the issue of "fight for 10 minutes, then rest all day", but that just seems to be the logical way of doing it. If I could get all of my work done in 10 minutes, then could take the rest of the day off, I'm pretty sure I would. It's not heroic, sure, but it's smart. Same with the Grimlock argument from before. Sure, every once in a while, it's fun to do one of those "lets see how long we can keep going without resting" things. In most cases, though, that just leads to TPKs; and that's something I want to avoid. D&D to me is a casual environment where friends get together and have fun. Sure, four 1st level heroes beating up a lone grimlock isn't heroic; unless that Grimlock leapt out and attacked them, using its heightened senses to hide before the PCs noticed it. Especially if it leapt out and incapacitated the group's Wizard. Heroism is subjective; I see it as living in a world where seemingly every bad thing in existence wants you dead. [nerd rage] And frankly, the CR system *is* a good way for new DMs to judge encounters, until they get a better handle on what their player characters can do. It's not a kludge, it's a helping hand. I'm sure you, in your infinite wisdom, can easily spot exactly how an encounter is going to go down, but some DMs are new, and need things like CR to help them out. It may not be elegant, but it works for what it was intended.[/nerd rage] 6) Neverending Buffs - These are much better than "1 minute per level" and the like buffs, in that they actually encourage people to go out and adventure all day. Actually, lets scrap them and just have Marshal/Dragon Shaman/Bard-like aura effects that are always on. Much easier and more thematic. 7) Combat Expertise / Power Attack - If options are a bad thing, I don't want to be good. As noted way back up at the top of this ranting, if players are having a hard time grasping the (rather simplistic) rules for Combat Expertise and/or Power Attack, they should either make up a cheat sheet or play something simpler. 8) Point Buy - In the real world, things aren't fair. In D&D, I expect everyone to at least start on something resembling equal footing. 9) Rerolls - As I'm sure someone pointed out before, it's called the Luck domain. It makes sense that it'll make you, oh I don't know, Lucky? Crimeny. Rerolls aren't bad, it's that they appearantly take all the fun out of it for killer DMs. Good. 10) Magic Item Creation - Again, XP = life-energy/soul/whatever. You're giving up part of your soul to make that magic item. That's pretty much how it worked in LotR and most fantasy type stuff I've read. Sorry for all the nerd rage earlier, but it's one of those days. It's a sore point for me when people say "This is what I don't like about 3e, but it doesn't matter because all I play is OD&D/1st Ed/2nd Ed, because they're far superior blah blah blah blah." If you're really that enamored with ye olde D&D, please, PLEASE stop complaining about "us kids today" with our newfangled "feats and skills and multiclassing". They're *different games*, stop trying to compare them. -TRRW [/QUOTE]
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