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<blockquote data-quote="Prestidigitalis" data-source="post: 5307072" data-attributes="member: 74496">Wow, it's amazing just how much difference in philosophies is revealed in the discussion here.While I want to be supportive of the OP, I have to side with the &quot;Are you nuts?&quot; crowd.&nbsp; If I were one of those players (not just the one who died twice) I think I would be pretty ticked off about that encounter.&nbsp; The Dominated status is not fun, and the way it was used seems harsh.As for the comments that a party with 4 strikers was the cause of the defeat, it's hard for me to picture how a couple of healing surges triggered by a leader would have helped, or how a controller forcing one of the five flying incubi to land would have made a difference.&nbsp; Sure, there are places where a balanced party would make a big difference, but I don't see it in this case.&nbsp; Can anyone give an actual example of how a non-striker could have turned the tide?Overall, I think that death by falling is far underrated as a source of total or partial PKs.&nbsp; In the campaigns I play in, fully half of all character deaths have been by falling.&nbsp; Frankly, I think it would be worth the time for the esteemed creators of 4e to do an article on how to add risk of falling to an encounter without making it unexpectedly deadly.Finally, let me just make a plea to DMs: You ask us - nay, beg, implore or even require us - to come up with great, detailed backgrounds for our characters.&nbsp; You want us to roleplay with relish and gusto, to dive into the character and make it come alive.&nbsp; And then, more often than I think is appropriate, you kill them off.&nbsp; The net result is that with each successive character generated, your players feel less and less excitement about doing all that great background stuff.&nbsp; Why bother, when the character's family, friends, former lover, second grade study partner, and latent lycanthropy never make an appearance at all due to premature demise? Obviously, this is worthy of its own thread, so I will leave it there.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Prestidigitalis, post: 5307072, member: 74496"] Wow, it's amazing just how much difference in philosophies is revealed in the discussion here. While I want to be supportive of the OP, I have to side with the "Are you nuts?" crowd. If I were one of those players (not just the one who died twice) I think I would be pretty ticked off about that encounter. The Dominated status is not fun, and the way it was used seems harsh. As for the comments that a party with 4 strikers was the cause of the defeat, it's hard for me to picture how a couple of healing surges triggered by a leader would have helped, or how a controller forcing one of the five flying incubi to land would have made a difference. Sure, there are places where a balanced party would make a big difference, but I don't see it in this case. Can anyone give an actual example of how a non-striker could have turned the tide? Overall, I think that death by falling is far underrated as a source of total or partial PKs. In the campaigns I play in, fully half of all character deaths have been by falling. Frankly, I think it would be worth the time for the esteemed creators of 4e to do an article on how to add risk of falling to an encounter without making it unexpectedly deadly. Finally, let me just make a plea to DMs: You ask us - nay, beg, implore or even require us - to come up with great, detailed backgrounds for our characters. You want us to roleplay with relish and gusto, to dive into the character and make it come alive. And then, more often than I think is appropriate, you kill them off. The net result is that with each successive character generated, your players feel less and less excitement about doing all that great background stuff. Why bother, when the character's family, friends, former lover, second grade study partner, and latent lycanthropy never make an appearance at all due to premature demise? Obviously, this is worthy of its own thread, so I will leave it there. [/QUOTE]

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