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I love 5E, but lately I miss 4E's monsters
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<blockquote data-quote="Manbearcat" data-source="post: 7014039" data-attributes="member: 6696971"><p>When I see you posts things like the above, I'm always left trying to shake off some stunned disbelief. You played 4e for a bit (thought I'm not sure that you GMed it?) so I know the nuance of things like those two creatures and how they are integrated into the greater whole can't be completely lost upon you.</p><p></p><p>1) Let's take a closer look at the Ancient Red Dragon:</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Soldier's have good defenses and control the melee around them to protect allies. The Red's Inferno aura protects servitors (who would inevitably have Resist 20 fire or outright immunity; Azer, Salamandyr) who may play a role in healing the Red or granting it action recovery, or force multiplying Artillery around the lair (or something else). If you're going to get at them, you're going to have to get up close and personal (and eat auto-fire damage and teeth) or plink away at -2 to hit.</p><p></p><p>Couple that with its other melee control abilities (and straight damage), its Breath Weapon (and rider), its ranged Immolate Foe ability and its stout front-line combatant with battlefield control and ally protection emerges. </p><p></p><p>Now a MM3/MV update would improve it by giving it the Action Recovery and Instinctive Assault of its Elder version and/or probably doubling the Inferno damage/size at Bloodied.</p><p></p><p>2) Let us take a look at the Ancient Blue (still MM1):</p><p></p><p>a) Basic attack rider "...and the target is pushed 3 squares and knocked prone."</p><p>b) Move Action:</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>c) If folks close to melee (or near it?), AoE stun:</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>d) and what self-respecting elemental juggernaut doesn't have a ranged AoE lightning bolt barrage for optimal kiting:</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>That is Thor as a giant blue lizard; highly mobile piece of lightning and thunder spewing artillery. In 4e, this combat would take place in a battlefield to accentuate such abilities. High cliffs with lots of drop-offs. Littered with pools of knee-deep water as hazards (to electrify from above). Quick-sand and minions to bog down the good guys. </p><p></p><p>Finally, the Elder (MM3 version) is even (much) better still (unsurprisingly). Yay:</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>So, I don't agree. Blue dragons' legacy is that of preferring to fight at distance. Reds are impulsive (due to well-earned confidence born on borderline invincibility) engines of destruction. They both look the part (on paper), and they definitely feel that way in play.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Manbearcat, post: 7014039, member: 6696971"] When I see you posts things like the above, I'm always left trying to shake off some stunned disbelief. You played 4e for a bit (thought I'm not sure that you GMed it?) so I know the nuance of things like those two creatures and how they are integrated into the greater whole can't be completely lost upon you. 1) Let's take a closer look at the Ancient Red Dragon: Soldier's have good defenses and control the melee around them to protect allies. The Red's Inferno aura protects servitors (who would inevitably have Resist 20 fire or outright immunity; Azer, Salamandyr) who may play a role in healing the Red or granting it action recovery, or force multiplying Artillery around the lair (or something else). If you're going to get at them, you're going to have to get up close and personal (and eat auto-fire damage and teeth) or plink away at -2 to hit. Couple that with its other melee control abilities (and straight damage), its Breath Weapon (and rider), its ranged Immolate Foe ability and its stout front-line combatant with battlefield control and ally protection emerges. Now a MM3/MV update would improve it by giving it the Action Recovery and Instinctive Assault of its Elder version and/or probably doubling the Inferno damage/size at Bloodied. 2) Let us take a look at the Ancient Blue (still MM1): a) Basic attack rider "...and the target is pushed 3 squares and knocked prone." b) Move Action: c) If folks close to melee (or near it?), AoE stun: d) and what self-respecting elemental juggernaut doesn't have a ranged AoE lightning bolt barrage for optimal kiting: That is Thor as a giant blue lizard; highly mobile piece of lightning and thunder spewing artillery. In 4e, this combat would take place in a battlefield to accentuate such abilities. High cliffs with lots of drop-offs. Littered with pools of knee-deep water as hazards (to electrify from above). Quick-sand and minions to bog down the good guys. Finally, the Elder (MM3 version) is even (much) better still (unsurprisingly). Yay: So, I don't agree. Blue dragons' legacy is that of preferring to fight at distance. Reds are impulsive (due to well-earned confidence born on borderline invincibility) engines of destruction. They both look the part (on paper), and they definitely feel that way in play. [/QUOTE]
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