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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Roland Delacroix" data-source="post: 406930" data-attributes="member: 1753">OMFG-Had to stop painting figs to replyJust so you know where i'm coming from, i'm running RttToEE right now.  Thulsa, it seems to me that you are highly resticting this group and because of that they are getting their ass beat.  I'm not surprised at the 23 deaths.  D&D assumes that when a character faces a CR he will have wealth appropriate to his level.  With the restrictions you are placing, your players are probably AT LEAST at -2 ECL.  Everything you are changing about your 3e game is typical of '2e syndrome'.  In 3e there are magic items galore, without them you will die.  In 3e there are powerfull spells, without them you will die.  In 3e there are powerfull abilities, without them you will die.  As your group has proven, you can't go into 3e with 2e assumptions.  If you want slow advancement and low power, you are in the WRONG GAME.  Get the new LotR game, I hear its good.This is a hard module.  For comparison, i'm letting my group go crazy with any feat, PrC, or item they wanna make.  I'm even handing out better spells from other books.  32 point buy too, allowing any races.  They still get beat down on a regular basis, with good tactics!  We have had 4 deaths so far, and we are just starting the CRM.Starting with RttToEE was a mistake as well, IMO.  This is a meat grinder adventure where Monte Cook munchkins every monster/spell and item in the core rules to tear your party up.  Not the best thing for a group new to 3e.  My group was pretty new to 3e as well, I started them at 1st level and played them up to 4th.  This gave us a chance to learn the system, them and me.  Worked out pretty well.Ormraxes:  I would get a new DM immediatly if I were you.  Don't let one guy screw up the whole 3e experience.  I know he means well, but it sounds like he needs some playing time to adjust.Gah, too angry to be coherent, i'll add more later.EDIT:  Later.  Ormraxes; when I posted above I didn't mean dropping this DM from the group, sorry if it sounded that way.  It's obvious he's a good friend of yours, and a good DM too.  Adjusting from 2e to 3e is very difficult for the hardcore 2e players because so many assumptions have changed.  I meant, maybe someone else should try DM'ing a group of new, 1st level characters.  Let everyone get a taste of the new game system before throwing them into the most difficult module out to date.  Trying to 'balance' out the game when noone fully understands it is impossible.  Thulsa:  It seems you are having a hard time dealing with the waaaay increased power level of 3e PC's.  Please, give 3e a chance before making changes.  Try restricting it to Core Rules only.  There are still many choices for your PC's and the stuff there has been playtested to death.  Thousands of gamers believe Core Rules work as-is, no deletions.  Every group is different, but cm'mon, give it a try.  A smart DM, which you sound like, should be able to challenge your party with whats given no matter what they have.  Try a few pre-made modules, they have monsters and treasure all laid out.  I suggest the Freeport series, and Of Sound Mind.  Sunless Citadel is supposed to be a good one too.  With those few under your (groups) belt you and your party should have an idea of where Dungeons and Dragons has changed.  It's a great game, but very different from 1e-2e.  I know, I still have a 1e game on thursdays, hardcore guys i'm gonna have to drag kicking and screaming into 3e.  <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f61b.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":P" title="Stick out tongue    :P"  data-smilie="7"data-shortname=":P" /></blockquote>

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