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<blockquote data-quote="MGibster" data-source="post: 5868519" data-attributes="member: 4534">You and I might be getting hung up on the word novice.&nbsp; I see a cleric as having received the training to fight (wear armor, swing a weapon, etc., etc.) but at 1st level he's still a novice.&nbsp; Just like a soldier who finishes basic training is still a novice.&nbsp; I don't think of a novice as someone who literally has no training.&nbsp; In D&amp;D, it would appear so.&nbsp; Or maybe they have tutors from outside the church who teach new clerics.&nbsp; Or, alternatively, maybe it's some sort of divine knowledge.&nbsp; Like how Paul Atreides already knew how to put on a still suit even though he had never worn one in his life.&nbsp; I'm not quite sure how to answer this.&nbsp; I think it's unreasonable to expect D&amp;D to do certain things unless you're willing to fiddle around with the rules.&nbsp; When I want a different fantasy gaming experience I play something besides D&amp;D.&nbsp; When I want something besides a literary Arthurian game I play something besides Pendragon.&nbsp; You know, learning it as they went sure sounds like training to me.&nbsp; Training doesn't have to come in the form of a formal school or setting.&nbsp; I assume the Sorcerer practiced how to use magic and has it all under control by 1st level.&nbsp; I assume the Warlock made a pact with some force that taught him how to cast his spells.&nbsp; I never thought much about the Barbarian but I figure someone taught him how to focus his rage into something useful.&nbsp; Of course that's just how I look at it.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="MGibster, post: 5868519, member: 4534"] You and I might be getting hung up on the word novice. I see a cleric as having received the training to fight (wear armor, swing a weapon, etc., etc.) but at 1st level he's still a novice. Just like a soldier who finishes basic training is still a novice. I don't think of a novice as someone who literally has no training. In D&D, it would appear so. Or maybe they have tutors from outside the church who teach new clerics. Or, alternatively, maybe it's some sort of divine knowledge. Like how Paul Atreides already knew how to put on a still suit even though he had never worn one in his life. I'm not quite sure how to answer this. I think it's unreasonable to expect D&D to do certain things unless you're willing to fiddle around with the rules. When I want a different fantasy gaming experience I play something besides D&D. When I want something besides a literary Arthurian game I play something besides Pendragon. You know, learning it as they went sure sounds like training to me. Training doesn't have to come in the form of a formal school or setting. I assume the Sorcerer practiced how to use magic and has it all under control by 1st level. I assume the Warlock made a pact with some force that taught him how to cast his spells. I never thought much about the Barbarian but I figure someone taught him how to focus his rage into something useful. Of course that's just how I look at it. [/QUOTE]

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