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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Patryn of Elvenshae" data-source="post: 2000192" data-attributes="member: 23094">Possible.I don't see it that way for several reasons.  (Of course, right?)If I were to summarize the Flanking section's paragraphs, it would be:1. What bonuses accrue when Flanking?2. How do you determine whether something is Flanking?3. So, how does this affect big and small creatures?The reason I have a hard time accepting that it's meant to be melee only now is that, in 3.0, they specifically stated "You are flanking only when you make a melee attack and an ally opposite threatens."In 3.5, they changed the definintion to, "You are flanking when a line between you and an ally crosses opposite sides / corners of your enemy."It would have been trivially easy to leave the melee-only statement in as part of the rules.  The revision team didn't.  I propose they changed the rules purposefully.  Others propose they did so accidentally.  I pick intention over incompetence.  <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f609.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=";)" title="Wink    ;)"  data-smilie="2"data-shortname=";)" />The other, main reason, is that bonuses and penalties arise from various states.  If you are invisible, you get a +2 on attack rolls, your opponent is denied his or her or its Dex bonus, and attacks against you suffer a 50% miss chance.If you are Flanking, you get a +2 bonus on melee attack rolls, and can sneak attack.If you are Disabled, you are limited to a move or standard action and take a point of damage if you strain yourself.  ( <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f609.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=";)" title="Wink    ;)"  data-smilie="2"data-shortname=";)" /> <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f600.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":D" title="Big grin    :D"  data-smilie="8"data-shortname=":D" /> )I believe, and the rules support in multiple cases, that not getting all the benefits or penalties of your condition does not remove the condition from you.A rogue flanking a vampire (and therefore unable to make sneak attacks) is still Flanking that vampire.  An invisible attacker striking a barbarian with Uncanny Dodge is still invisible, even if the Barbarian doesn't lose his Dex bonus to AC.I believe, likewise, that it is possible to still Flank your foe even if you don't get the +2 bonus on your attack roll.</blockquote>

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