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<blockquote data-quote="Balesir" data-source="post: 5982710" data-attributes="member: 27160">OK, so you want long term conditions - like petrification, disease and so on. That is something I would expect to (still) be there.So is this what you see as the player aim in the game? Long term tactical and strategic success? If so, how can they ever succeed based on their own merits without balance?True as far as it goes, but this is still one of many areas I wish the designers had expanded upon and made use of the (immense) potential they had sitting there before ditching the edition. What is there is very neat, but rather sparse.The real world doesn't have encounters. Nor does it have hit points, levels, character classes, experience points or markets for &quot;magic items&quot; that defy all economic sense and logic. But D&amp;D does, because it isn't real life and cannot possibly run by the same rules as the real world.Time in the real world is postulated to be a measure of the number of &quot;events&quot; (on a subatomic level) occurring. What does that make time in a roleplaying game? A measure of the number of decisions made by the players (including the GM)? Or a measure of the challenges faced and overcome by the characters, maybe? If the latter, voila - the &quot;encounter&quot;.If that is so, why didn't it come up with anything at all in that arena? Especially when other games did so - starting, I think, with MegaTraveller in the mid-80's.How you can &quot;backpedal&quot; from no system at all I'm hard pressed to imagine, but that combat balance needs to be &quot;traded&quot; for better non-combat systems seems like a non-sequitur, to me.SWSE is not D&amp;D - plenty of non-D&amp;D games have had better non-combat conflict/challenge resolution systems than D&amp;D, but that wasn't the claim, as I read it. The claim was that no other edition of D&amp;D has had as good a non-combat conflict/challenge resolution system. Since no other edition of D&amp;D has had such a system at all (&quot;roll skill vs a DC&quot; is not such a system - it's just part of such a system, with challenge/scene framing and XP assignment elements needed, at a minimum, in addition), I can't see how that is even a contentious statement.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Balesir, post: 5982710, member: 27160"] OK, so you want long term conditions - like petrification, disease and so on. That is something I would expect to (still) be there. So is this what you see as the player aim in the game? Long term tactical and strategic success? If so, how can they ever succeed based on their own merits without balance? True as far as it goes, but this is still one of many areas I wish the designers had expanded upon and made use of the (immense) potential they had sitting there before ditching the edition. What is there is very neat, but rather sparse. The real world doesn't have encounters. Nor does it have hit points, levels, character classes, experience points or markets for "magic items" that defy all economic sense and logic. But D&D does, because it isn't real life and cannot possibly run by the same rules as the real world. Time in the real world is postulated to be a measure of the number of "events" (on a subatomic level) occurring. What does that make time in a roleplaying game? A measure of the number of decisions made by the players (including the GM)? Or a measure of the challenges faced and overcome by the characters, maybe? If the latter, [I]voila[/I] - the "encounter". If that is so, why didn't it come up with anything at all in that arena? Especially when other games did so - starting, I think, with MegaTraveller in the mid-80's. How you can "backpedal" from no system at all I'm hard pressed to imagine, but that combat balance needs to be "traded" for better non-combat systems seems like a non-sequitur, to me. SWSE is not D&D - plenty of non-D&D games have had better non-combat conflict/challenge resolution systems than D&D, but that wasn't the claim, as I read it. The claim was that no other edition [B][I]of D&D[/I][/B] has had as good a non-combat conflict/challenge resolution system. Since no other edition of D&D has had such a system at all ("roll skill vs a DC" is not such a system - it's just part of such a system, with challenge/scene framing and XP assignment elements needed, at a minimum, in addition), I can't see how that is even a contentious statement. [/QUOTE]

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