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Message: <blockquote data-quote="ForeverSlayer" data-source="post: 5986195" data-attributes="member: 91812">Why does it matter anyway to be honest?Why would your Wizard even go that route when there is already a rogue present? The problem here is you aren't comparing like for like. The Wizard is able to mimic some of the rogue but not fully. Basically what you want is to close off all doors to where no other class can doing anything another class can do. In all my 30 years of gaming, I have never once seen a player try and mimic the actions of another when that class is already present in the party. I have had a few Wizards pack a few Knock spells just in case the rogue goes down but that's it. I've also had players who wanted roguish wizards so they had a few rogue like spells that were similar but hey that's okay, you can never have enough rogues in the party. Are you going to get made if the fighter out damages the barbarian or vice verse? The biggest problem I've seen with most of these Wizard arguments is the fact that they bank on the Wizard always having the right spell, monsters failing their saves, monsters standing in the perfect formation with their thumbs in their mouths, the Wizard having the best action economy on the planet and a whole slew of other things. Vacuums don't exist in real games so they don't belong in the conversation.</blockquote>