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<blockquote data-quote="Ulorian - Agent of Chaos" data-source="post: 9229117" data-attributes="member: 16668">I think the idea here is that the DM describes the scene in a way that is not breaking immersion. For some (like me and you), giving a DC to climb a wall or whatever game-facing numerical description, doesn't take us out of the game. For others, like a few folks arguing in this thread, it apparently does. In [USER=29398]@Lanefan[/USER], et al.'s view, the DM describes the scene in a way that the player knows how difficult/possible things are given what their character can interpret as a being in the game world. The player can then describe the action while the DM does the calculation behind the scene. I don't personally feel the need to play this way, but I understand the appeal. It's not about taking away player agency (which seems what might be getting up your nose), but about preserving immersion (as unnecessary as I find this approach to making the game more appealing).You can decide for yourself what constitutes crossing a social line. I found that you did, for whatever that's worth. I've been behind most of the arguments you've made in this thread btw... just being fair to both sides here.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Ulorian - Agent of Chaos, post: 9229117, member: 16668"] I think the idea here is that the DM describes the scene in a way that is not breaking immersion. For some (like me and you), giving a DC to climb a wall or whatever game-facing numerical description, doesn't take us out of the game. For others, like a few folks arguing in this thread, it apparently does. In [USER=29398]@Lanefan[/USER], et al.'s view, the DM describes the scene in a way that the player knows how difficult/possible things are given what their character can interpret as a being in the game world. The player can then describe the action while the DM does the calculation behind the scene. I don't personally feel the need to play this way, but I understand the appeal. It's not about taking away player agency (which seems what might be getting up your nose), but about preserving immersion (as unnecessary as I find this approach to making the game more appealing). You can decide for yourself what constitutes crossing a social line. I found that you did, for whatever that's worth. I've been behind most of the arguments you've made in this thread btw... just being fair to both sides here. [/QUOTE]

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