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Message: <blockquote data-quote="James Heard" data-source="post: 3393090" data-attributes="member: 7280">I think part of the problem with bards is that bards only seriously shine during face time, and in a story-driven game a lot of players are going to try for face time. If the entire rest of the party is expecting to have some sort of player-to-NPC chat moment no matter what their actual skills are (and they're also filling customary and more standard roles) then bards are in trouble. And if the GM doesn't strictly enforce the whole "He's got a 4 points of CHA on you and a whole slew of skills that says he's more likable" and goes more along with the actual player's conversation? Then the bard becomes some sort of second rate buffer/healer/crappy fighter with the dubious benefit of bardic knowledge - but bardic knowledge is horribly dependent on how the GM arbitrates things too.Basically a wizard or a fighter are always as good as their dice in combat, but a bard has to rely on the GM wanting to make the rolls for him. That makes them suboptimal in a lot of playing environments and under a lot of GMs.</blockquote>