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<blockquote data-quote="eyebeams" data-source="post: 3323172" data-attributes="member: 9225"><p>This is obviously at odds with the intent of people who talk about how the awards are "fan-run." If you accept the definition of "fan" above -- a definition that goes at odds with previous discussions and definitions of fandom in every other arena, making it dubious to use at face value -- you make the whole distinction meaningless.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>It has nothing to do with assuming honesty or dishonesty. If it's a fan award, it should be a fan award. Not a kinda-sorta-fan award that in practice is handed around to people associated with a handful of for-profit companies, including the one that happens to run this site. For me, this means that the ENnies are associated with companies that are direct competitors for the same market segment I target.</p><p></p><p>The point is not to remove intentional bias. The point is to make the awards as sincere gesture of fan appreciation as practically possible. It doesn't look as sincere when non-fans (by the common definition used in actual fandom instead of a overly vague definition) are a prominent part of the mix.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Sure you can. You can do it by mandating that no judge have any paid credit in the production of a commercial RPG or have recieved payment from a company for any service, with the exception of complimentary product for review.</p><p></p><p>There, that was easy. Now why isn't it in the rules for a fan award? It ain't rocket science, folks.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Obviously, everyone is not doing it. Tim Dugger isn't, and that's why this thread exists. If the awards process has aliented ICE, that's no good, really.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Reductio ad absurdum. You are saying that since you can't make awards totally fair, you may as well just give up. This doesn't make any sense. Having actual fans instead of kinda-sorta-industry folks judge a supposed fan award does make sense? </p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Nobody's saying anything about perfection. I'm talking about basic credibility.</p><p></p><p>If people absolutely cannot do without paid industry people judging, then the ENnies should create a category separate from the fan awards. Otherwise, the ENnies should be an actual fan award.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="eyebeams, post: 3323172, member: 9225"] This is obviously at odds with the intent of people who talk about how the awards are "fan-run." If you accept the definition of "fan" above -- a definition that goes at odds with previous discussions and definitions of fandom in every other arena, making it dubious to use at face value -- you make the whole distinction meaningless. It has nothing to do with assuming honesty or dishonesty. If it's a fan award, it should be a fan award. Not a kinda-sorta-fan award that in practice is handed around to people associated with a handful of for-profit companies, including the one that happens to run this site. For me, this means that the ENnies are associated with companies that are direct competitors for the same market segment I target. The point is not to remove intentional bias. The point is to make the awards as sincere gesture of fan appreciation as practically possible. It doesn't look as sincere when non-fans (by the common definition used in actual fandom instead of a overly vague definition) are a prominent part of the mix. Sure you can. You can do it by mandating that no judge have any paid credit in the production of a commercial RPG or have recieved payment from a company for any service, with the exception of complimentary product for review. There, that was easy. Now why isn't it in the rules for a fan award? It ain't rocket science, folks. Obviously, everyone is not doing it. Tim Dugger isn't, and that's why this thread exists. If the awards process has aliented ICE, that's no good, really. Reductio ad absurdum. You are saying that since you can't make awards totally fair, you may as well just give up. This doesn't make any sense. Having actual fans instead of kinda-sorta-industry folks judge a supposed fan award does make sense? Nobody's saying anything about perfection. I'm talking about basic credibility. If people absolutely cannot do without paid industry people judging, then the ENnies should create a category separate from the fan awards. Otherwise, the ENnies should be an actual fan award. [/QUOTE]
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