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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Feldspar" data-source="post: 2756696" data-attributes="member: 20450">I thought I'd do something a little different and try to build a rogue character that uses heavy armor in order to increase survivability in toe to toe combat while flanking.  Seems crazy, I know, but I thought I'd try my hand at it to see if it can be made to work or not.A couple of key quotes from the SRD: <ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">You can’t use [Tumble] if your speed has been reduced by armor, excess equipment, or loot.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">"Dwarf base land speed is 20 feet. However, dwarves can move at this speed even when wearing medium or heavy armor or when carrying a medium or heavy load (unlike other creatures, whose speed is reduced in such situations).</li> </ul>Are you thinking what I'm thinking?My idea is specifically for a warforged rogue with the Adamantine Body feat, since the race's +2 CON, and the damage reduction granted by this feat will help in toe-to-toe combat even more.  Any other ideas to make this silly concept work?Playing a Dwarf will also give you  +2 CON plus a host of other goodies. <ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">favored class: Fighter - you're going to be taking at least one level of fighter for the weapon and armor proficiencies</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">free proficiency with Dwarven Waraxe and Urgosh - assuming you take that Fighter level</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">+2 saving throw bonus vs. poison - I suspect frontliners have more exposure to poison and you don't have a Fighters pure Fort save, this will help</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">+2 saving throw bonus vs. spells and spell-like effects - losing Evasion is a bitter to pill to swallow but at least you'll make more saving throws in general</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Darkvision - never a bad thing to have</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Stability bonus - less vulnerable to some combat maneuvers</li> </ul>You'll have to get your damage reduction from Dwarven (Adamantine) Plate <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" />So, can anyone think of any feats, prestige classes, or items that will help offset these penalties?  Here's what I've come-up with so far: * Heavy Armor Optimization and Greater Heavy Armor Optimization increase the armor bonus by 1 each, and reduce the armor check penalties by 1 and 2, respectively, for a total +2 AC and -3 armor check penalty. * Skill focus and related feats can partially offset armor check penalties, although at a great cost. * Slick, Shadow, and Silent Moves armor abilities from the DMG offset the penalties to Escape Artist, Hide, and Move Silently checks, respectively. * The Nimbleness ability from Magic of Faerun reduces armor check penalties by 1, and increases max DEX by 2.I think I have a better solution to your Armor Check Penalty problems - punt!  Forget about trying to be a stealthy scout.  Let a monk, ranger, wild shaped druid, familiar, etc handle that role if the party really needs one.  For that matter, I'd be willing to argue that the only two must-have required skills for a party's Rogue are Search and Disable Device, both of which are Int based skills unaffected by ACP.  Actually, if its an Eberron campaign, then even the trap handler role can be filled by another class - the Artificer.Spot, Listen, UMD and Open Lock are all useful Rogue skills without an armor check penalty - and for that matter only Open Lock requires Dex.  Sure its going to be harder to Tumble, but its a fixed (fairly low) DC, not an opposed check.  Just keep throwing skill points at the problem and you'll eventually be good enough.  Throw at least 5 points into it so that you have access to the better fighting defensive bonuses.  And you also have all the social skills (such wonderful synergy bonuses) to play with as well.So, forget about Dex, unless you need it for Dodge.  Its now a luxury stat.  Your two key stats are Con to make up for your lower hit die and Str for attack and damage.  Int maybe if you really want to be a skill monkey - that's a good concept: a very intelligent character who makes up for physical shortcomings (str/dex) by wrapping himself in the best armor he can find and hitting his opponents in exactly the place its really going to hurt.One feat that looks interesting for this character is Karmic Strike.  You're standing there in a flanking position, how nice would it be to trade their hit on you for another sneak attack opportunity.  Not a good tradeoff (at higher levels) when opponent has a large number of attacks per round, but still interesting.</blockquote>

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