Menu
News
All News
Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
Pathfinder
Starfinder
Warhammer
2d20 System
Year Zero Engine
Industry News
Reviews
Dragon Reflections
White Dwarf Reflections
Columns
Weekly Digests
Weekly News Digest
Freebies, Sales & Bundles
RPG Print News
RPG Crowdfunding News
Game Content
ENterplanetary DimENsions
Mythological Figures
Opinion
Worlds of Design
Peregrine's Nest
RPG Evolution
Other Columns
From the Freelancing Frontline
Monster ENcyclopedia
WotC/TSR Alumni Look Back
4 Hours w/RSD (Ryan Dancey)
The Road to 3E (Jonathan Tweet)
Greenwood's Realms (Ed Greenwood)
Drawmij's TSR (Jim Ward)
Community
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Resources
Wiki
Pages
Latest activity
Media
New media
New comments
Search media
Downloads
Latest reviews
Search resources
EN Publishing
Store
EN5ider
Adventures in ZEITGEIST
Awfully Cheerful Engine
What's OLD is NEW
Judge Dredd & The Worlds Of 2000AD
War of the Burning Sky
Level Up: Advanced 5E
Events & Releases
Upcoming Events
Private Events
Featured Events
Socials!
EN Publishing
Twitter
BlueSky
Facebook
Instagram
EN World
BlueSky
YouTube
Facebook
Twitter
Twitch
Podcast
Features
Top 5 RPGs Compiled Charts 2004-Present
Adventure Game Industry Market Research Summary (RPGs) V1.0
Ryan Dancey: Acquiring TSR
Q&A With Gary Gygax
D&D Rules FAQs
TSR, WotC, & Paizo: A Comparative History
D&D Pronunciation Guide
Million Dollar TTRPG Kickstarters
Tabletop RPG Podcast Hall of Fame
Eric Noah's Unofficial D&D 3rd Edition News
D&D in the Mainstream
D&D & RPG History
About Morrus
Log in
Register
What's new
Search
Search
Search titles only
By:
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
Upgrade your account to a Community Supporter account and remove most of the site ads.
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
If 4e went in this direction...
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="ThirdWizard" data-source="post: 5522178" data-attributes="member: 12037"><p>I think there are a few dangers here.</p><p></p><p>First, the thing that pops into my head is that this would have to be all or nothing. You wouldn't want one PC to have a trait unless all the PCs had a trait, and those traits would have to be at least roughly balanced with each other. So, if one character had a Gladiator, another had a Multiclass-Wizard, and another had a Half-elf trait, all of them would have to be roughly equivalent. This is a tall order for such disparate ideals, each of which has a different goal behind it. The gladiator trait was designed as a character background, the multiclass for character breadth, and the race for character definition.</p><p></p><p>Of course, Prestige Classes started with much the same noble goals. We saw what can happen, though, where things can get way out of hand. I'm not saying that makes it a bad thing. It's just something to watch out for. Power creep as well as bloat are things that can tank good ideas.</p><p></p><p>I'd drop half-races from this. It doesn't seem worth it, and with the options afforded a trait over 30 levels, your half dwarf might end up more dwarf than a dwarf! Not to mention that does that mean half-elves can't be multiclass? That's crazy talk for anyone coming from ye olde editions. Lastly, traits are more like subclasses anyway, and races are not thought of in that context currently in the game. I could see them being implemented like that in the future or in an alternate system, but it doesn't seem to fit right now.</p><p></p><p>Traits would absolutely make a better multiclassing system, though. When I think multiclassing in 4e, I don't even think feats, I think hybrid. I haven't seen anybody multiclass using feats since hybridizing came out. I think this would be a much more elegant solution. Each class, upon release, would have a short multiclass writeup as well, or maybe it would be imbedded in the class writeup somehow. Then if you wanted to multi- into another class, it would all be right there for you. </p><p></p><p>I also think I'm going to now use Traits for my 4e Planescape games when I start one up again for Factions. They fit in perfectly with that idea, and I could see them being a great tool. They fit so much better than Paragon Paths or feat trees, or Backgrounds, or anything else I have ever thought about trying. Traits are... clean... that way.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="ThirdWizard, post: 5522178, member: 12037"] I think there are a few dangers here. First, the thing that pops into my head is that this would have to be all or nothing. You wouldn't want one PC to have a trait unless all the PCs had a trait, and those traits would have to be at least roughly balanced with each other. So, if one character had a Gladiator, another had a Multiclass-Wizard, and another had a Half-elf trait, all of them would have to be roughly equivalent. This is a tall order for such disparate ideals, each of which has a different goal behind it. The gladiator trait was designed as a character background, the multiclass for character breadth, and the race for character definition. Of course, Prestige Classes started with much the same noble goals. We saw what can happen, though, where things can get way out of hand. I'm not saying that makes it a bad thing. It's just something to watch out for. Power creep as well as bloat are things that can tank good ideas. I'd drop half-races from this. It doesn't seem worth it, and with the options afforded a trait over 30 levels, your half dwarf might end up more dwarf than a dwarf! Not to mention that does that mean half-elves can't be multiclass? That's crazy talk for anyone coming from ye olde editions. Lastly, traits are more like subclasses anyway, and races are not thought of in that context currently in the game. I could see them being implemented like that in the future or in an alternate system, but it doesn't seem to fit right now. Traits would absolutely make a better multiclassing system, though. When I think multiclassing in 4e, I don't even think feats, I think hybrid. I haven't seen anybody multiclass using feats since hybridizing came out. I think this would be a much more elegant solution. Each class, upon release, would have a short multiclass writeup as well, or maybe it would be imbedded in the class writeup somehow. Then if you wanted to multi- into another class, it would all be right there for you. I also think I'm going to now use Traits for my 4e Planescape games when I start one up again for Factions. They fit in perfectly with that idea, and I could see them being a great tool. They fit so much better than Paragon Paths or feat trees, or Backgrounds, or anything else I have ever thought about trying. Traits are... clean... that way. [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
If 4e went in this direction...
Top