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General Tabletop Discussion
*Dungeons & Dragons
If an NPC is telling the truth, what's the Insight DC to know they're telling the truth?
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<blockquote data-quote="5ekyu" data-source="post: 7583777" data-attributes="member: 6919838"><p>Specifically regarding this...</p><p></p><p>"So, a the check result is compared to the DC. I'm pretty sure we'll all agree what happens on a success -- the poisoned handle is discovered! But, what happens on a failure? That's murky. Some tabkes will offer "you find nothing" and wait for further actions that may engage the trap. Others might deckare that the poison was touched, which sets up the "I didn't say I touched that!" argument. The failure options are either 'nothing' or assuming actions on the PC's behalf that are harmful. And, this is perfectly fine if the table agrees the GM has this authority over PC actions. Not my preference, but perfectly fine."</p><p></p><p>Those options sound a lot like declaring that a failure can have two outcomes, not just one. </p><p></p><p>It's almost like saying that a failure on an ability check can be either "making no progress" (you find no traps) or some progress with a setback determined by the GM (you found a trap but you tripped it.) </p><p></p><p>As such, I would say that in 5e, that "agreed authority" to make such a call by the GM is given in the PHB under ability checks where it specifically states that a failure on an ability check gives the GM both those options. </p><p></p><p>"Otherwise, it's a failure, which means the character or monster makes no progress toward the objective or makes progress combined with a setback determined by the DM." PHB Chapter 7 using Ability Scores </p><p></p><p>Now, if it's me, I might decide for some traps that trip while searching is still better than just walking into, grabbing the handle etc ("makes progress") and give the save advantage under the "actions that helped" category. </p><p></p><p>But, just saying that in explicit RAW the authority to have the different resolutions for a failed trap check is already there. It can be in the same game, same table not needing different tables. </p><p></p><p>Meanwhile, the describe it sure doesnt prevent table differences. One table might have some or all who know the grizzly vs brown bear aggression response. Another might.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="5ekyu, post: 7583777, member: 6919838"] Specifically regarding this... "So, a the check result is compared to the DC. I'm pretty sure we'll all agree what happens on a success -- the poisoned handle is discovered! But, what happens on a failure? That's murky. Some tabkes will offer "you find nothing" and wait for further actions that may engage the trap. Others might deckare that the poison was touched, which sets up the "I didn't say I touched that!" argument. The failure options are either 'nothing' or assuming actions on the PC's behalf that are harmful. And, this is perfectly fine if the table agrees the GM has this authority over PC actions. Not my preference, but perfectly fine." Those options sound a lot like declaring that a failure can have two outcomes, not just one. It's almost like saying that a failure on an ability check can be either "making no progress" (you find no traps) or some progress with a setback determined by the GM (you found a trap but you tripped it.) As such, I would say that in 5e, that "agreed authority" to make such a call by the GM is given in the PHB under ability checks where it specifically states that a failure on an ability check gives the GM both those options. "Otherwise, it's a failure, which means the character or monster makes no progress toward the objective or makes progress combined with a setback determined by the DM." PHB Chapter 7 using Ability Scores Now, if it's me, I might decide for some traps that trip while searching is still better than just walking into, grabbing the handle etc ("makes progress") and give the save advantage under the "actions that helped" category. But, just saying that in explicit RAW the authority to have the different resolutions for a failed trap check is already there. It can be in the same game, same table not needing different tables. Meanwhile, the describe it sure doesnt prevent table differences. One table might have some or all who know the grizzly vs brown bear aggression response. Another might. [/QUOTE]
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If an NPC is telling the truth, what's the Insight DC to know they're telling the truth?
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