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General Tabletop Discussion
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If an NPC is telling the truth, what's the Insight DC to know they're telling the truth?
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<blockquote data-quote="Oofta" data-source="post: 7592472" data-attributes="member: 6801845"><p>Just for grins I decided to look up where people were getting the "there has to be a meaningful consequence for failure" so I looked it up. I think the phrase is being completely overblown and taken out of context.</p><p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px">When a player wants to do something, it’s often appropriate to let the attempt succeed without a roll or a reference to the character’s ability scores. <strong>For example, a character doesn’t normally need to make a Dexterity check to walk across an empty room or a Charisma check to order a mug of ale.</strong> Only call for a roll if there is a meaningful consequence for failure.</p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p><p></p><p>I think the example is fairly clear, but people quoting the rule seem skip the example which is kind of a critical clarification because it's pretty obvious they're talking about mundane tasks. </p><p></p><p>It also continues on to say:</p><p></p><p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px">When deciding whether to use a roll, ask yourself two questions:</p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px">Is a task so easy and so free of conflict and stress that there should be no chance of failure?</p> <p style="margin-left: 20px">Is a task so inappropriate or impossible — such as hitting the moon with an arrow — that it can’t work?</p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"><strong>If the answer to both of these questions is no, some kind of roll is appropriate.</strong></p><p></p><p>So ... if a PC wants to try to break out of manacles, is there a chance of failure (for most PCs)? Yes. Therefore you need to look at the next line</p><p></p><p style="margin-left: 20px">If the answer to both of these questions is no, some kind of roll is appropriate.</p><p></p><p>There's no requirement for meaningful consequence for failure, just a chance of failure. Is this contradictory? I don't think so, it's just that the section is general suggestions written in a casual language not parsed as a legal document. Well, that and it's just a suggestion ... run the game the way that makes sense to you. But if you're going to quote rules, quote them in context.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Oofta, post: 7592472, member: 6801845"] Just for grins I decided to look up where people were getting the "there has to be a meaningful consequence for failure" so I looked it up. I think the phrase is being completely overblown and taken out of context. [INDENT] When a player wants to do something, it’s often appropriate to let the attempt succeed without a roll or a reference to the character’s ability scores. [B]For example, a character doesn’t normally need to make a Dexterity check to walk across an empty room or a Charisma check to order a mug of ale.[/B] Only call for a roll if there is a meaningful consequence for failure. [/INDENT] I think the example is fairly clear, but people quoting the rule seem skip the example which is kind of a critical clarification because it's pretty obvious they're talking about mundane tasks. It also continues on to say: [INDENT] When deciding whether to use a roll, ask yourself two questions: Is a task so easy and so free of conflict and stress that there should be no chance of failure? Is a task so inappropriate or impossible — such as hitting the moon with an arrow — that it can’t work? [B]If the answer to both of these questions is no, some kind of roll is appropriate.[/B][/INDENT] So ... if a PC wants to try to break out of manacles, is there a chance of failure (for most PCs)? Yes. Therefore you need to look at the next line [INDENT]If the answer to both of these questions is no, some kind of roll is appropriate.[/INDENT] There's no requirement for meaningful consequence for failure, just a chance of failure. Is this contradictory? I don't think so, it's just that the section is general suggestions written in a casual language not parsed as a legal document. Well, that and it's just a suggestion ... run the game the way that makes sense to you. But if you're going to quote rules, quote them in context. [/QUOTE]
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If an NPC is telling the truth, what's the Insight DC to know they're telling the truth?
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