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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Charlaquin" data-source="post: 7599224" data-attributes="member: 6779196">Alright, man. If you want to give your players unfair challenges on purpose and they're cool with it, you have fun with that.-.- I didn't offer any reasoning because it doesn't matter. Obviously we're never going to agree on this, and it seems clear at this point that you are understanding my position here, and simply hold a different one. So, I'm satisfied with that. You see where I'm coming from re: telegraphing, and you have a different preference, and that's fine. I'm not interested in trying to change your mind.You say that like it's an objective fact, but this lich and his dungeon don't actually exist. You made the scenario up. You didn't have to set it up specifically to make any telegraphing not make sense, that was a conscious choice. Maybe you think that's more fun. I don't.Have you tried asking your players if they would prefer a fair challenge or an unfair one? I have a feeling which one they'd pick.Look, man, I don't think you need to telegraph the identity of your elf or whatever. I've been talking about traps and hazards here, you're the one who decided to extend it to mysteries.I've been saying all along that I wouldn't tell the players consequences it wasn't reasonable for their characters to know. I've also been saying that my preference is to set challenges up in such a way that it is reasonable for the characters to know the potential consequences of their actions, because that leads to a gameplay experience I think is more enjoyable for most players.It's impossible for you as a player to mistakenly blunder into unexpected consequences. Because doing so isn't fun. Again, this is not a controversial thing at my table. I've never had a player express that they wish I wouldn't let them know what consequences their actions might lead to. You're conflating "mistakenly blunder into an unexpected consequence" with "fail to notice a trap." My playstyle does not prevent players from failing to notice traps. Players get nailed by traps with some frequency in my games, even with the telegraphing I do. They just don't unknowingly spring traps as results of failed rolls to disarm traps they have spotted. Sometimes they knowingly do so though.What the heck are you babbling about?Yes, a judgment Hussar is implicitly making by calling out the clear delineation between player's and DM's rolls as an example of a place where the 5e rules are written for inexperienced players. Something I disagree with.Yes, he is making the mistake of thinking that his preference (a "give and take" style) is a more refined one than the one the 5e rules present as standard, when in reality it is simply a preference that is neither more or less refined.It is saying that his preference is not more refined, as his statement seemed to suggest it was.I agree, that was a pretty bold thing for Hussar to suggest!That's a pretty impressive misreading of what I said. And yet you left in your mis-analysis of my post for some reason.</blockquote>

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