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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Anubis" data-source="post: 359443" data-attributes="member: 2358">Harm needs a save.  Think about it, and compare it to other Clkeric spells.Slay Living: 5th-level spell, touch, save or die, save takes 3d6+X damageDestruction: 7th-level spell, target, save or die, save takes 10d6 damageNotice that both have saves, and both deal damage on a successful save, but only one requires an attack.  Attacks are easier to make than saves in nearly every circumstance, so a touch spell with no save is more powerful than a target spell with a save.Harm and Heal, being 6th-level spells, should fall between these two spells.Being reduced to 1d4 hp, for all intent and purposes, is the same as death.  The power of this spell isn't about NPCs using it on PCs, but rather a PARTY of PCs going up against SINGLE creatures of an appropriate CR, such as a devil, demon, or dragon.  When a PARTY goes up against a single powerful creature, a common tactic is for Cleric to delay and Fighter to ready an action to attack after Cleric casts his spell.  They have discussed tactics already and know the score.  Cleric uses Harm, Fighter attacks and kills.  Not INSTANT death, but that is semantic nonsense because I have yet in my years of gaming seen an enemy bounce back from Harm.  That along says something.You can't make decisions on the POSSIBILITY that the enemy could dodge or heal himself or herself, but rather on averages.  On average, anything hit by Harm dies.This is simply not right, seeing as it overpowers EVRY OTHER SPELL on the Cleric list except for Miracle and MAYBE Gate.  Against single enemies, Harm is UNBEATABLE.If you MUST keep the spell powerful, I suggest giving it a save and getting rid of the touch attack.  If that doesn't work for you, keep the touch attack, give it a save, make it 5th-level instead of 6th-level, and make Say Living and Raise Dead 6th-level spells.Here is my personal suggestion.HarmNecromancyLevel: Clr 6, Destruction 6, Drd 7Components: V, SCasting Time: 1 actionRange: TouchTarget: Creature touchedDuration: InstantaneousSaving Throw: Will half (see text)Spell Resistance: YesHarm charges a subject with negative energy that causes the loss of all but 1d4 hit points.  Upon a successful save, the subject is reduced to half of its current hit points.If used on an undead creature, Harm acts like Heal.To balance this with Slay Living, which now *seems* more powerful, simply give Slay Living AND Raise Dead casting times of 1 round.  That should fix all problems.</blockquote>

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