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Message: <blockquote data-quote="WizarDru" data-source="post: 3073286" data-attributes="member: 151">Allow me to join the chorus of those who run 3.X straight out of the box.  Our only remaining house-rule is that you if you roll a '1l for hit points, you get to reroll it once.  We've always adhered to the equipment guidelines as written, as well.I suspect that my players would argue against that point.  You may have had no success with the CR system, but I certainly don't find it useless.  On the contrary, I find it very helpful for a baseline.  At high levels, you need to adjust it some around the relative threat to the party, but that doesn't invalidate it, in my eyes.  It merely makes it a much better benchmark than purely eyeballing it.One thing that no one has pointed, that Monte Cook highlighte years ago, is that levels are part of the carrot-and-stick philosophy that makes levels so appealing.  Every level potentially offers something to the character and a very tangible change to your character, even if it's only slightly better saves and a hit point or two.  Don't underestimate how powerful a draw that is.  In a levelless system like GURPS, getting a few points in drips and drabs just isn't that exciting, compared with taking a new level in D&D.  The change is much more dramatic...and if it's immediacy somewhat tests the verisimilude form some folks, that a small price to play for a proven game mechanic IN A GAME.As to Japanese RPGs making levels seamless, it should be noted that often those levels are very static.  Yes, I got another level of Lord in Fire Emblem or Sora gets another level in Kingdom Hearts...they're really just artificial constructs.  You have no control over the levelling process, and since all the enemies scale at roughly the same time, it's not really the same as a level in D&D.  It's nice, but it's really not nearly the same kind of experience.So back to the original question - Why have levels?It's a good question, really. 2ed was HORRIBLY broken - far worse than 3.x, but that was partly due to being overgrown and overdeveloped. It FORCED players and GM's to customize their game from the truckload of content out there. The systemization of 2ed was barely there. However, when the Options and Powers books came out, something interesting happened - something that could with a lot of work be applied to 3e.Turning all class specific abilities into point-bought abilities that you purchase upon "leveling", you could, actually, have the versatility of creating the type of character you want (possibly doing away with Prestige classes since everyone is customized within the boundaries of what the GM allows). 3.x Options and Powers? 4e? Who knows. Interesting idea. I think d20 can be pushed a lot further than the current flatland systemic idiosyncracies that cause games to fracture post 13th level anyhow. WotC quality is slowly getting better, and more dynamic... SLOWLY (I credit Mearls on this. He GETS IT). I still can't help but feel their flavor of d20 is bland compared to some of the other companies in the field - Green Ronin and AEG for that matter.I'm definitely looking forward to 4e. Bring it on.</blockquote>[/QUOTE]

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