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<blockquote data-quote="Anubis" data-source="post: 787417" data-attributes="member: 2358">The thing is, UK, I have presented a middle-ground wherein you count any scores above and beyond the &quot;normal&quot; range in CR while ignoring anything within the &quot;standard array&quot;.&nbsp; That is why I advocate adding racial modifiers to ability scores into CR.First, however, please explain your little weird ratings for CR where you mention one as (normal) and another as (difficult), as you just did with the Pit Fiend.&nbsp; That is nowhere in the rules, and you have not explained it in any way.Beyond that, I would say that we can get away with taking ability scores out of the picture altogether.&nbsp; If anything, it'll lower most monster CRs while keeping PCs roughly the same.&nbsp; At any given time in the first 40 levels, standard PCs won't get more than +3 for their ability scores, and even then it won't be until the higher levels anyway.&nbsp; The system balances itself out, as I believe the lower-rated Pit Fiend you gave is far more accurate if not still overrated.&nbsp; I would rate Pit Fiends at CR 20-22 AT MOST for a &quot;normal&quot; encounter that takes 20% of the party's resources.Anyway, it should work either way.&nbsp; Count racial bonuses or don't count anything at all, I believe it still works in playtesting.&nbsp; Counting the ability scores obviously does NOT work in playtesting at low levels, though, so it should be removed if you want a universal system.&nbsp; Just try it out in a game.&nbsp; Make some characters and run them against some beasties and check your results.&nbsp; I have.&nbsp; We can get away with not counting ability scores.For divinity, simply put, just add the ability scores into the divinity templates and leave it at that, because those ARE pretty hefty bonuses.&nbsp; We ain't talking no 10 or 20 above the norm there, we're talking about 90 above the norm hahaha!Anyway, I don't think the numbers look weird at all.&nbsp; Well they may LOOK weird, but in playtesting, those numbers without the ability socres work just fine.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Anubis, post: 787417, member: 2358"] The thing is, UK, I have presented a middle-ground wherein you count any scores above and beyond the "normal" range in CR while ignoring anything within the "standard array". That is why I advocate adding racial modifiers to ability scores into CR. First, however, please explain your little weird ratings for CR where you mention one as (normal) and another as (difficult), as you just did with the Pit Fiend. That is nowhere in the rules, and you have not explained it in any way. Beyond that, I would say that we can get away with taking ability scores out of the picture altogether. If anything, it'll lower most monster CRs while keeping PCs roughly the same. At any given time in the first 40 levels, standard PCs won't get more than +3 for their ability scores, and even then it won't be until the higher levels anyway. The system balances itself out, as I believe the lower-rated Pit Fiend you gave is far more accurate if not still overrated. I would rate Pit Fiends at CR 20-22 AT MOST for a "normal" encounter that takes 20% of the party's resources. Anyway, it should work either way. Count racial bonuses or don't count anything at all, I believe it still works in playtesting. Counting the ability scores obviously does NOT work in playtesting at low levels, though, so it should be removed if you want a universal system. Just try it out in a game. Make some characters and run them against some beasties and check your results. I have. We can get away with not counting ability scores. For divinity, simply put, just add the ability scores into the divinity templates and leave it at that, because those ARE pretty hefty bonuses. We ain't talking no 10 or 20 above the norm there, we're talking about 90 above the norm hahaha! Anyway, I don't think the numbers look weird at all. Well they may LOOK weird, but in playtesting, those numbers without the ability socres work just fine. [/QUOTE]

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