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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Anubis" data-source="post: 1388868" data-attributes="member: 2358">Wulf, you have totally lost all logic.  You think all 14s or all 10s aren't unlikely?  The odds of rolling the same score six times in a row are in the vicinity of 1 to 16,777,216.  That isn't just unlikely, it's damn near never gonna happen!You examples are amusing at best, but regardless of the supposed "accuracy", it simply doesn't hold up in playtesting.  You can't balance the rules on a on-on-one basis, you have to use a party of PCs as the core because that is THE standard.  Straight duels are mighty rare, and ability scores simply don't have that great an impact.  Sure, a fighter with all 14s has an advantage over the guy with all 10s, but the difference in how many times one will win over the other is miniscule at best, probably in the realm of 60/40 in favor of the guy with higher stats, IF THAT.  It just doesn't have enough impact.As for counting templates, it's as was said, the POTENTIAL is what matters.  The rolled potential with +4 to a stat goes from 3-18 to 7-22.  If luck gives him a raw deal, well, that's luck.  Making rules that account for luck is not only dumb, it's impossible!  I have already showed a REAL GAME OCCURANCE where counting ability scores for PCs screwed the PCs over.  All Wulf does is propose a bunch of stupid tests that couldn't even happen in a game, and no one has shown even one instance where not counting PCs' ability scores destroys or even hurts balance.  I can give many examples on my side if people ask for them.  (Hint: Try looking at ghouls.)Plain and simple, count ability scores for templates if you want to, even count racial bonuses if you must, but never ever count anything regarding the rolled range for ability scores for PCs.  That is the one major sticking point that breaks the system.</blockquote>

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