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<blockquote data-quote="(Psi)SeveredHead" data-source="post: 2846547" data-attributes="member: 1165">Unfortunately, Improved Bull Rush's prime use (shoving people off cliffs, into pits, etc) is determined by the terrain, not the PC. There's no rules for simply shoving someone into a wall. The inability to actually avoid it kind of breaks my suspension of disbelief (if you have a halfling rogue Str 8 Dex 20 you can't avoid it), but if the victim gets to dodge, that makes the feat useless. A bit of a catch 22.One of the best uses is shoving someone through a Wall of Fire or Blade Barrier - oh wait, that kind of screws the bull rusher, too, as they have to move with the victim.I find Awesome Blow way better. I don't see why any creature that has Improved Bull Rush that also meets the requirements for Awesome Blow wouldn't take Awesome Blow instead. It's dodgeable (because it's an attack roll), but the victim can't just say &quot;I'm stepping out of the way&quot;. You don't have to screw yourself to use it, and it's useable regardless of the terrain - terrain just makes it better. Too bad you can only knock an opponent ten feet - I think a Titan should be able to &quot;wind up&quot; and knock the opponent for distance <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f600.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":D" title="Big grin&nbsp; &nbsp; :D"&nbsp; data-smilie="8"data-shortname=":D" />Improved Overrun is lame. There's no way for the initiator of the maneuver to avoid the AoO. The victim gets to choose whether they make an AoO or just get out of the way. So the initiator either runs the risk of getting skewered (and may knock over the victim), or they didn't impact their opponent at all.I think I might have taken Improved Bull Rush once, and never got to use it. Twice I saw characters use Improved Trip to effectively bull rush people five feet (as a house rule - and one of those two characters was my NPC).</blockquote>

[QUOTE="(Psi)SeveredHead, post: 2846547, member: 1165"] Unfortunately, Improved Bull Rush's prime use (shoving people off cliffs, into pits, etc) is determined by the terrain, not the PC. There's no rules for simply shoving someone into a wall. The inability to actually avoid it kind of breaks my suspension of disbelief (if you have a halfling rogue Str 8 Dex 20 you can't avoid it), but if the victim gets to dodge, that makes the feat useless. A bit of a catch 22. One of the best uses is shoving someone through a Wall of Fire or Blade Barrier - oh wait, that kind of screws the bull rusher, too, as they have to move with the victim. I find Awesome Blow [i]way better[/i]. I don't see why any creature that has Improved Bull Rush that also meets the requirements for Awesome Blow wouldn't take Awesome Blow instead. It's dodgeable (because it's an attack roll), but the victim can't just say "I'm stepping out of the way". You don't have to screw yourself to use it, and it's useable regardless of the terrain - terrain just makes it better. Too bad you can only knock an opponent ten feet - I think a Titan should be able to "wind up" and knock the opponent for distance :D Improved Overrun is lame. There's no way for the initiator of the maneuver to avoid the AoO. The [i]victim[/i] gets to choose whether they make an AoO or just get out of the way. So the initiator either runs the risk of getting skewered (and may knock over the victim), or they didn't impact their opponent at all. I think I might have taken Improved Bull Rush once, and never got to use it. Twice I saw characters use Improved Trip to effectively bull rush people five feet (as a house rule - and one of those two characters was my NPC). [/QUOTE]

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