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<blockquote data-quote="N'raac" data-source="post: 6727011" data-attributes="member: 6681948">Actually, I see a lot of players, who I will suggest view the game much like howandwhy99, who have no intention of playing a &quot;real person&quot; making difficult decisions in a difficult situation.&nbsp; Rather, they are playing a cipher, a plastic playing pawn which attempts to adopt the most tactically advantageous approach to every situation.These are the players whose characters, faced with the choice of accepting a d6 roll on which 1 means &quot;gain substantial wealth&quot; and 6 means &quot;die horribly&quot; will keep rolling until one of the two results is attained, as &quot;vast wealth&quot; will provide the player a pawn with&nbsp; more power in the game, while &quot;horrible death&quot; just means he starts out a new pawn.&nbsp; How many &quot;real persons&quot; want to sign up for Russian Roulette?&nbsp; Their pawn is not a &quot;character&quot; - it has no emotions, no human flaws or foibles, no principals or goals, beyond &quot;maximize advantage in game&quot;.No thanks.&nbsp; I can play the Dungeon board game, the D&amp;D board game, or any number of other games where I ruthlessly seek mathematical advantage to win, under the terms of victory set out by the rules.&nbsp; To view D&amp;D purely as a tactical exercise makes it a &quot;game&quot;, but D&amp;D is not solely a game.&nbsp; It is a Role Playing Game.&nbsp; Remove the &quot;character&quot; from the character, and it is just a game.&nbsp; A 'G', not an RPG.The GM does not role play the PC's - that is the role of the players.&nbsp; But it is his role to place the characters in situations where the characters are challenged.&nbsp; If we reduce this to mere 'G', we challenge only their tactical skills, and the powers of the characters.&nbsp; But a good GM will also challenge the players to role play their characters - what is more important to him, protecting the innocent or destroying the evil?&nbsp; Will he sacrifice his principals for power or wealth?&nbsp; What happens when the stereotypical threatened village is brought to life as a PC's childhood home?In a pure 'game' view, my character (PAWN) should be an orphan with no real principals or objectives beyond personal safety, power and wealth.&nbsp; The GM will use any ethics, principals, personal connections, etc. as leverage to prevent the achievement of 'winning' the game.&nbsp; In an RPG, the GM will use those character flaws, foibles and background elements to bring life to the characters and the game.&nbsp; How much more satisfying to not only achieve victory, but to do so without compromising the character's principals.In a pure game, the choice will be &quot;lose or sacrifice your principals&quot;.&nbsp; In a good RPG, the challenge is often not merely to win, but to win within those principals.In a game, the constraints of a Paladin's code will disadvantage him constantly.&nbsp; In an RPG, challenges to his principals and ethics will be as, or more, enjoyable and challenging as challenges to his strength at arms, and his sterling reputation and past acts of charity and benevolence will return to his benefit in unexpected ways.If I wanted a board game, I'd go to the closet and get a board game.&nbsp; I play an RPG for a different purpose.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="N'raac, post: 6727011, member: 6681948"] Actually, I see a lot of players, who I will suggest view the game much like howandwhy99, who have no intention of playing a "real person" making difficult decisions in a difficult situation. Rather, they are playing a cipher, a plastic playing pawn which attempts to adopt the most tactically advantageous approach to every situation. These are the players whose characters, faced with the choice of accepting a d6 roll on which 1 means "gain substantial wealth" and 6 means "die horribly" will keep rolling until one of the two results is attained, as "vast wealth" will provide the player a pawn with more power in the game, while "horrible death" just means he starts out a new pawn. How many "real persons" want to sign up for Russian Roulette? Their pawn is not a "character" - it has no emotions, no human flaws or foibles, no principals or goals, beyond "maximize advantage in game". No thanks. I can play the Dungeon board game, the D&D board game, or any number of other games where I ruthlessly seek mathematical advantage to win, under the terms of victory set out by the rules. To view D&D purely as a tactical exercise makes it a "game", but D&D is not solely a game. It is a Role Playing Game. Remove the "character" from the character, and it is just a game. A 'G', not an RPG. The GM does not role play the PC's - that is the role of the players. But it is his role to place the characters in situations where the characters are challenged. If we reduce this to mere 'G', we challenge only their tactical skills, and the powers of the characters. But a good GM will also challenge the players to role play their characters - what is more important to him, protecting the innocent or destroying the evil? Will he sacrifice his principals for power or wealth? What happens when the stereotypical threatened village is brought to life as a PC's childhood home? In a pure 'game' view, my character (PAWN) should be an orphan with no real principals or objectives beyond personal safety, power and wealth. The GM will use any ethics, principals, personal connections, etc. as leverage to prevent the achievement of 'winning' the game. In an RPG, the GM will use those character flaws, foibles and background elements to bring life to the characters and the game. How much more satisfying to not only achieve victory, but to do so without compromising the character's principals. In a pure game, the choice will be "lose or sacrifice your principals". In a good RPG, the challenge is often not merely to win, but to win within those principals. In a game, the constraints of a Paladin's code will disadvantage him constantly. In an RPG, challenges to his principals and ethics will be as, or more, enjoyable and challenging as challenges to his strength at arms, and his sterling reputation and past acts of charity and benevolence will return to his benefit in unexpected ways. If I wanted a board game, I'd go to the closet and get a board game. I play an RPG for a different purpose. [/QUOTE]

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