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<blockquote data-quote="Rampant" data-source="post: 5718128" data-attributes="member: 52859"><p>"Go on about your business" is admittedly less likely to cause suspicion, in fact many characters (Yeargar for instance) could go days without triggering sense motive checks under those orders. The trick is the PC victims at the very least have not been given this command, the cleric that first used detect evil has in fact been told to lie to his group about the results. Now assuming that the cleric is not out to get his party killed this should have triggered no less than 4 rolls. 1 extra saving throw for the cleric, 1 for his bluff check, and then two sense motive checks for every party member who was there (one each for the lie, and one each for the dominate effect).</p><p></p><p>If your party failed all those sense motive rolls, and the cleric has anything less than a +20 bluff then the only conclusion is that the dice gods hate your players, and you should offer up a stack of playing cards or a bag of doritos in sacrifice.</p><p></p><p>As for a control effect that doesn't leave obvious signs, there's not many, the simple fact is that in order to take a person over enough to control their decisions and actions with traditional magic you have to squelch their personality a bit. A smart manipulator would make liberal use of charm, suggestion, and social skills to take over, he could have the whole house convinced he's a damphyre or a good vamp, or that he's simply too valuable to let random ruffians screw up the deal, or both. The evil aura could have been explained by the vampirism being inherently evil magic overriding his actual intent/alignment. Really your vamp screwed the pooch when he dominated the cleric.</p><p></p><p>Now what your guy could do to control people without making them robots is to turn them, if it's been overcast more than a few years everyone's probably getting pale so it's easier for vampires and their spawn to walk amongst the people. Now of course this has limits since undead generally have a limit to how many HD of spawn they can control (generally their HD times their Cha mod), and this might be a house rule but I think in addition to having a limit on the number of HD the spawner can control I think they automatically lose control of any spawn with more HD than them.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Rampant, post: 5718128, member: 52859"] "Go on about your business" is admittedly less likely to cause suspicion, in fact many characters (Yeargar for instance) could go days without triggering sense motive checks under those orders. The trick is the PC victims at the very least have not been given this command, the cleric that first used detect evil has in fact been told to lie to his group about the results. Now assuming that the cleric is not out to get his party killed this should have triggered no less than 4 rolls. 1 extra saving throw for the cleric, 1 for his bluff check, and then two sense motive checks for every party member who was there (one each for the lie, and one each for the dominate effect). If your party failed all those sense motive rolls, and the cleric has anything less than a +20 bluff then the only conclusion is that the dice gods hate your players, and you should offer up a stack of playing cards or a bag of doritos in sacrifice. As for a control effect that doesn't leave obvious signs, there's not many, the simple fact is that in order to take a person over enough to control their decisions and actions with traditional magic you have to squelch their personality a bit. A smart manipulator would make liberal use of charm, suggestion, and social skills to take over, he could have the whole house convinced he's a damphyre or a good vamp, or that he's simply too valuable to let random ruffians screw up the deal, or both. The evil aura could have been explained by the vampirism being inherently evil magic overriding his actual intent/alignment. Really your vamp screwed the pooch when he dominated the cleric. Now what your guy could do to control people without making them robots is to turn them, if it's been overcast more than a few years everyone's probably getting pale so it's easier for vampires and their spawn to walk amongst the people. Now of course this has limits since undead generally have a limit to how many HD of spawn they can control (generally their HD times their Cha mod), and this might be a house rule but I think in addition to having a limit on the number of HD the spawner can control I think they automatically lose control of any spawn with more HD than them. [/QUOTE]
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