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<blockquote data-quote="pawsplay" data-source="post: 5619739" data-attributes="member: 15538">No, that is not a dissociated mechanic. There is no feinting mechanic, for one thing. Feinting is simply generalized into to-hit rolls.That is not dissociated, either, since people who shoot for the eyes do not always hit them. In fact, it's safe to assume people are always shooting for the eyes, if the opportunity presents itself. Actually being able to make called shots to the eyes is more likely to be dissociated, since it's rare that a game would closely model whether or not the eyes were a reasonably available target.Not dissociated. In fact, saving throws are a flat-out simulation.Do you understand that glossing over the very subject of discussion and considering it solved is frustrating? None of those are dissociated mechanics. It has been claimed a couple of times that dissociation is just a level of abstraction, but I do not accept that position. Something can be highly abstracted but still completely immersive.Player: We go back to the inn.GM: Twenty minutes later, you arrive at the inn. Another example:GM: There are still two guards by the door.Player: Are they the same guards from before?GM: Yes.Traveling a couple of miles, or recognizing another person on sight, are both considerable and complex tasks. But they aren't exactly really challenging, most of the time, so it's worthwhile to simply abstract the tasks. There is no really justifiable reason to make the players play out a twenty minute walk in real time, or to make the players roll a series of Spot/Perception checks in order to determine something that is easily determined.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="pawsplay, post: 5619739, member: 15538"] No, that is not a dissociated mechanic. There is no feinting mechanic, for one thing. Feinting is simply generalized into to-hit rolls. That is not dissociated, either, since people who shoot for the eyes do not always hit them. In fact, it's safe to assume people are always shooting for the eyes, if the opportunity presents itself. Actually being able to make called shots to the eyes is more likely to be dissociated, since it's rare that a game would closely model whether or not the eyes were a reasonably available target. Not dissociated. In fact, saving throws are a flat-out simulation. Do you understand that glossing over the very subject of discussion and considering it solved is frustrating? None of those are dissociated mechanics. It has been claimed a couple of times that dissociation is just a level of abstraction, but I do not accept that position. Something can be highly abstracted but still completely immersive. Player: We go back to the inn. GM: Twenty minutes later, you arrive at the inn. Another example: GM: There are still two guards by the door. Player: Are they the same guards from before? GM: Yes. Traveling a couple of miles, or recognizing another person on sight, are both considerable and complex tasks. But they aren't exactly really challenging, most of the time, so it's worthwhile to simply abstract the tasks. There is no really justifiable reason to make the players play out a twenty minute walk in real time, or to make the players roll a series of Spot/Perception checks in order to determine something that is easily determined. [/QUOTE]

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