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General Tabletop Discussion
*TTRPGs General
In Defense of the Theory of Dissociated Mechanics
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<blockquote data-quote="Hussar" data-source="post: 5629627" data-attributes="member: 22779"><p>Whoo boy, this one is long. <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f600.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":D" title="Big grin :D" data-smilie="8"data-shortname=":D" /> Let's take it point by point.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Stop right there. Something to remember, and I'm now wondering if you have me on ignore, because I've repeated this a couple of times and it hasn't stuck yet, it's entirely possible to narrate this exact same effect all three ways in the SAME encounter.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>No different than 3e - facing does not apply. Note, that it's not a gaze attack, which does have specific mechanics applied, so, applying gaze mechanics to this power is beyond the scope of the power itself.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>AFAIK, Anti-magic barriers are a 3e construct and generally don't exist in 4e.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Well, I'm not sure which scrying type ritual you want to use, so I picked Observe Creature. Since I am outside of its range, I don't know why it would be capable of affecting me through any ritual I can think of. It's no different than trying to use any other power.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>See above.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Again, there is no silence spell in 4e. There is a ritual that makes things quieter while inside the area, but, since this is a close blast, it would be extremely difficult to use the ritual in combat.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>How do they know to close their eyes in the first place? And, since this is a magical, mind effecting fear effect, isn't it basically planting the image in your brain?</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Having narrative control and changing the rules are two different things. This would be a house rule and any problems that arise from house rules are not the fault of the mechanics.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Just how many times are they going to encounter this particular type of creature over the course of 30 levels? Being able to exploit meta-game knowledge gained because you've memorized the Monster Manual is not behavior I want to reward.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Oh come on. Please. First off, "chop off its hands" isn't something ANY version of D&D does. Secondly, who says it actually needs those hands to shoot those bolts. You chop off the hands and the bolts come from the stumps. Problem solved.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>No, one answer to our dilemma is don't play with dicks. If the player is going to be such a prat that he's trying this sort of thing to exploit, rules lawyer fashion, every single thing that comes out of the DM's mouth, I'd much rather get a new player.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Umm, you realize that in the Robot Chicken episode, the power he was trying to use was the 4e version of Faerie Fire and actually dealt no damage? While his explaination was maybe problematic, the ruling certainly wasn't.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>It's only a landmine if the player is actively trying to exploit loopholes. It's no different than the player trying to exploit loopholes in the written rules as well. </p><p></p><p>When the players are actively engaged in the game and not busy trying to twist every situation that comes from their DM's mouth, the game runs a lot better.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Hussar, post: 5629627, member: 22779"] Whoo boy, this one is long. :D Let's take it point by point. Stop right there. Something to remember, and I'm now wondering if you have me on ignore, because I've repeated this a couple of times and it hasn't stuck yet, it's entirely possible to narrate this exact same effect all three ways in the SAME encounter. No different than 3e - facing does not apply. Note, that it's not a gaze attack, which does have specific mechanics applied, so, applying gaze mechanics to this power is beyond the scope of the power itself. AFAIK, Anti-magic barriers are a 3e construct and generally don't exist in 4e. Well, I'm not sure which scrying type ritual you want to use, so I picked Observe Creature. Since I am outside of its range, I don't know why it would be capable of affecting me through any ritual I can think of. It's no different than trying to use any other power. See above. Again, there is no silence spell in 4e. There is a ritual that makes things quieter while inside the area, but, since this is a close blast, it would be extremely difficult to use the ritual in combat. How do they know to close their eyes in the first place? And, since this is a magical, mind effecting fear effect, isn't it basically planting the image in your brain? Having narrative control and changing the rules are two different things. This would be a house rule and any problems that arise from house rules are not the fault of the mechanics. Just how many times are they going to encounter this particular type of creature over the course of 30 levels? Being able to exploit meta-game knowledge gained because you've memorized the Monster Manual is not behavior I want to reward. Oh come on. Please. First off, "chop off its hands" isn't something ANY version of D&D does. Secondly, who says it actually needs those hands to shoot those bolts. You chop off the hands and the bolts come from the stumps. Problem solved. No, one answer to our dilemma is don't play with dicks. If the player is going to be such a prat that he's trying this sort of thing to exploit, rules lawyer fashion, every single thing that comes out of the DM's mouth, I'd much rather get a new player. Umm, you realize that in the Robot Chicken episode, the power he was trying to use was the 4e version of Faerie Fire and actually dealt no damage? While his explaination was maybe problematic, the ruling certainly wasn't. It's only a landmine if the player is actively trying to exploit loopholes. It's no different than the player trying to exploit loopholes in the written rules as well. When the players are actively engaged in the game and not busy trying to twist every situation that comes from their DM's mouth, the game runs a lot better. [/QUOTE]
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