Reply to thread

Message

<blockquote data-quote="Final Attack" data-source="post: 4417881" data-attributes="member: 61181">I think the idea of intimidating a bloodied opponent into surrendering is an interesting idea, if potentially quite powerful, because of its potential &quot;instant win&quot;.&nbsp;When I play I would be incline to spend a feat to boost this chance as &quot;instant win&quot; &gt; +1 dmg/round.&nbsp; Feats are not exactly rare either.&nbsp;So, a Paladin, or Warlord Dragonborn focused on STR and CHR (18), and a skill focus feat can have:2 - racial4 - attribute3 - skill focus (cost a feat)5 - trained&nbsp;Total of +14 at level one.&nbsp; Now assuming the average low level will save is 17 (white dragon).&nbsp; You'll need a 27 to intimidate the dragon into defeat.&nbsp; this is a roll of 13+ which is a 40% chance.&nbsp; Pretty good.&nbsp;Next issue the assist ally.&nbsp; Now if a party of 5 all assist this dragonborn.&nbsp; Assuming they are ok at inimidate and they get 2 successes.&nbsp; He'll get a +4 (with the rare potential of +8).&nbsp; That increases his chances to 55% success.&nbsp;Further to this as the game progresses their are powers that provide + to next skill check and re-rolls.&nbsp; If the party ranger has trained intimidate. Level 2 &quot;crucial advice&quot; will allow any other party member a re-roll a failed intimidate as an encounter power, with bonuses possibly +4.&nbsp; &nbsp;Their are further ways to buff later.&nbsp; Such as the lvl 6 rogueutility power &quot;mob mentaility&quot; +2 which is again an encounter power.&nbsp;At level 6 assuming perfect party (not likely but possible) - Rogue, Ranger, Paladin, others (cleric, wizard).&nbsp;Vs Bloodied Young Red Dragon (lvl 6) at 166 HP or less.&nbsp; Will save 21. Giving DC 31 (+10 hostile)1. Rogue uses mob mentaility (gives all party +2 intimidate)2. All party members ready action to assist Paladins intimidate.3. 2 successes when aided by 4 allies (reasonable result, +4 for paladin)4. Dragonborn Paladin rolls his intimidate check with a total +2 racial +4 attribute +5 trained +3 skill focus +3 (level) +2 mob mentaility +4 assist = Total +23, with the option to re-roll.&nbsp; It will require a 8+ which is a 65% chance.&nbsp; With the chance of re-roll its something like 85% (or higher with the +wis added to the next roll.&nbsp;I agree that this is pretty situational.&nbsp; But even an average situation with the DM disallowing assists.&nbsp; No rogue in party. Ranger and Paladin intimidate combination still will have a higher than 50% chance of success.&nbsp; Which is useable every encounter.&nbsp;Is it really unlikely a party will optimise to an &quot;bloodied = win&quot; party?</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Final Attack, post: 4417881, member: 61181"] I think the idea of intimidating a bloodied opponent into surrendering is an interesting idea, if potentially quite powerful, because of its potential "instant win". When I play I would be incline to spend a feat to boost this chance as "instant win" > +1 dmg/round. Feats are not exactly rare either. So, a Paladin, or Warlord Dragonborn focused on STR and CHR (18), and a skill focus feat can have: 2 - racial 4 - attribute 3 - skill focus (cost a feat) 5 - trained Total of +14 at level one. Now assuming the average low level will save is 17 (white dragon). You'll need a 27 to intimidate the dragon into defeat. this is a roll of 13+ which is a 40% chance. Pretty good. Next issue the assist ally. Now if a party of 5 all assist this dragonborn. Assuming they are ok at inimidate and they get 2 successes. He'll get a +4 (with the rare potential of +8). That increases his chances to 55% success. Further to this as the game progresses their are powers that provide + to next skill check and re-rolls. If the party ranger has trained intimidate. Level 2 "crucial advice" will allow any other party member a re-roll a failed intimidate as an encounter power, with bonuses possibly +4. Their are further ways to buff later. Such as the lvl 6 rogueutility power "mob mentaility" +2 which is again an encounter power. At level 6 assuming perfect party (not likely but possible) - Rogue, Ranger, Paladin, others (cleric, wizard). Vs Bloodied Young Red Dragon (lvl 6) at 166 HP or less. Will save 21. Giving DC 31 (+10 hostile) 1. Rogue uses mob mentaility (gives all party +2 intimidate) 2. All party members ready action to assist Paladins intimidate. 3. 2 successes when aided by 4 allies (reasonable result, +4 for paladin) 4. Dragonborn Paladin rolls his intimidate check with a total +2 racial +4 attribute +5 trained +3 skill focus +3 (level) +2 mob mentaility +4 assist = Total +23, with the option to re-roll. It will require a 8+ which is a 65% chance. With the chance of re-roll its something like 85% (or higher with the +wis added to the next roll. I agree that this is pretty situational. But even an average situation with the DM disallowing assists. No rogue in party. Ranger and Paladin intimidate combination still will have a higher than 50% chance of success. Which is useable every encounter. Is it really unlikely a party will optimise to an "bloodied = win" party? [/QUOTE]

Verification