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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Cerebral Paladin" data-source="post: 5520898" data-attributes="member: 3448">Four additional comments about the "Epic-ness" of Into the Maelstrom:First, the fact that it is clearly and directly based on the Odyssey contributes to the Epic feel in my opinion.  I think it also makes it a less good game, but it gives it a resonance.  "We still talk about Odysseus roughly 3000 years after the poem was probably composed--your PCs belong in the same category in their world."Second, it's worth noting that the module is also designed to explicitly start the process of the apotheosis of the PCs--if they succeed in impressing an appropriate Immortal, that Immortal can become their sponsor on a Path of Immortality.  The Paths of Immortality are a key part of Master D&D's Epic-ness.Third, the far off weird worlds and kingdoms aren't just akin to 4E's use of planar settings for Epic--they are a direct antecedent.  IIRC, the far off places are explicitly other planes, and they fit in to a general pattern where Basic-Expert adventures are intended to be all on the Prime, Companion adventures introduce the idea of traveling to other planes, but mostly in the context of occasional sojourns to the other Inner Planes (elemental or Ethereal exploits) while expecting that mostly characters will be adventuring on the Prime and being the movers and shakers in their kingdoms, and Master level adventures are assumed to include extraplanar shenanigans at the drop of a hat, including traveling to what are essentially other Primes and to the Outer Planes.Fourth, I think the mass combat aspects are worth emphasizing.  These are a major part of Companion level play as well, but part of what makes Master-level adventures Epic is that you are assumed to be capable of organizing and leading giant armies (sometimes on the spur of the moment), in addition to battling the Epic foes that lead the other armies.  In this sense, Companion-level play can be viewed as introducing the idea that you would lead armies and fight wars and rule countries, and then Master-level takes it up to 11:  now you rule Kingdoms and establish dynasties, or raise armies at the drop of a hat in a foreign world, or fight extraplanar armies of monsters.  The analogy to 4E's structure would be introducing mass combat in Paragon (maybe late Paragon), but keeping it and turning it up to a higher level in Epic, with it maybe fading towards the end of Epic as you move beyond the capabilities of mere armies.I'm not sure that M1 is a particularly good adventure; but Master level D&D is a great model for how to run an Epic campaign.</blockquote>

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