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*TTRPGs General
Introducing Complications Without Forcing Players to Play the "Mother May I?" Game
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<blockquote data-quote="Manbearcat" data-source="post: 7560813" data-attributes="member: 6696971"><p>[MENTION=29398]Lanefan[/MENTION] and [MENTION=85555]Bedrockgames[/MENTION] , I’ll get a reply up afterwhile on my thoughts on your responses.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>A few thoughts on this:</p><p></p><p>1) The issue I personally have with the anti-competition social dynamic you’re referring to is a few-fold.</p><p></p><p>A - Humans stratify their peer groups and greater social arrangements via the establishment of dominance hierarchies. This is done via competition. It is a fundamental part of our evolved psychology and there is strong evidence that it persisted before we came down from the trees 300 k years ago.</p><p></p><p>B - So even children inherently understand competition and will engage in behaviors that facilitate this peer stratification...no matter what silly social engineering adults attempt. </p><p></p><p>C - On social engineering via brief removal of competition incentives (everyone gets a trophy)...it’s completely ignorant to believe that thousands and thousands of years of evolved psychology (and the attendant biology) is going to be undone by removing competition incentives in the brief moments where adults are supervising childrens’ play.</p><p></p><p>2 - Your point above always vexes me when I see it for many reasons:</p><p></p><p>- In TTRPGs, I don’t perceive the GM role as guardian/parent/overseer.</p><p></p><p>- In TTRPGs, I don’t perceive the players’ roles as that of children.</p><p></p><p>- In TTRPGs, I perceive social engineering as a dysfunctional play priority.</p><p></p><p>- In TTRPGs, peer network stratification via intraparty competition in a team based social game seems like an input to play that is begging for table dysfunction to arise. Even old school Skilled Play (which I engage in regularly) is “team vs obstacle.” That mode is an input that engenders good table results (assuming a referee understands their actual role, their constraints, and doesn’t assume an adversarial, “I’m competing against the players” dysfunctional position.</p><p></p><p></p><p>So sum told, I don’t think the comparison is anywhere near apt.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Manbearcat, post: 7560813, member: 6696971"] [MENTION=29398]Lanefan[/MENTION] and [MENTION=85555]Bedrockgames[/MENTION] , I’ll get a reply up afterwhile on my thoughts on your responses. A few thoughts on this: 1) The issue I personally have with the anti-competition social dynamic you’re referring to is a few-fold. A - Humans stratify their peer groups and greater social arrangements via the establishment of dominance hierarchies. This is done via competition. It is a fundamental part of our evolved psychology and there is strong evidence that it persisted before we came down from the trees 300 k years ago. B - So even children inherently understand competition and will engage in behaviors that facilitate this peer stratification...no matter what silly social engineering adults attempt. C - On social engineering via brief removal of competition incentives (everyone gets a trophy)...it’s completely ignorant to believe that thousands and thousands of years of evolved psychology (and the attendant biology) is going to be undone by removing competition incentives in the brief moments where adults are supervising childrens’ play. 2 - Your point above always vexes me when I see it for many reasons: - In TTRPGs, I don’t perceive the GM role as guardian/parent/overseer. - In TTRPGs, I don’t perceive the players’ roles as that of children. - In TTRPGs, I perceive social engineering as a dysfunctional play priority. - In TTRPGs, peer network stratification via intraparty competition in a team based social game seems like an input to play that is begging for table dysfunction to arise. Even old school Skilled Play (which I engage in regularly) is “team vs obstacle.” That mode is an input that engenders good table results (assuming a referee understands their actual role, their constraints, and doesn’t assume an adversarial, “I’m competing against the players” dysfunctional position. So sum told, I don’t think the comparison is anywhere near apt. [/QUOTE]
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