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General Tabletop Discussion
*TTRPGs General
Introducing Complications Without Forcing Players to Play the "Mother May I?" Game
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<blockquote data-quote="Imaro" data-source="post: 7561198" data-attributes="member: 48965"><p>You keep failing to engage the question of degrees. You were asked earlier if the GM/DM setting a 1% chance (or even a 0% chance) is in practice any different from him deciding the outcome "unilaterly" (and if he can say yes to anything he feels should auto-succeed is that in any way different from deciding unilateraly what the outcome is?)... and yet you continue to dance around that point. Could you answer that question which has been posed numerous times by myself and @<em><strong><u><a href="http://www.enworld.org/forum/member.php?u=6688277" target="_blank">Sadras</a></u></strong></em> instead of arguing against something neither of us have claimed? Mainly that unilateral decision making on the part of the DM/GM is the <strong>EXACT</strong> same as setting a DC.</p><p></p><p>EDIT: The point mostly being that when you give the DM the ability to determine DC's using his own judgement (which both 4e and Traveler do, not sure about BW) you are in fact, for all intents and purposes, giving him the power to decide unilaterally whether something is possible or not (though the DM/GM doesn't necessarily have to invoke said power)... the difference as I see it being one is justified through manipulation/granularity of mechanics vs outright denial/acceptance (and even this gets a little shaky with stuff like say yes). </p><p></p><p>Note: We are not speaking to how you in particular run a game...we are speaking to what the rules of said game allow. You keep making this point about 4e but if I assume as has been argued by many of it's proponents that we use the challenge to set DC's and the DM has unilateral control over what challenges are presented to the players... how do the mechanics of 4e not allow for the situation posted above (mainly an impossible DC or a DC so trivially easy you can;t help but pass)?</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Imaro, post: 7561198, member: 48965"] You keep failing to engage the question of degrees. You were asked earlier if the GM/DM setting a 1% chance (or even a 0% chance) is in practice any different from him deciding the outcome "unilaterly" (and if he can say yes to anything he feels should auto-succeed is that in any way different from deciding unilateraly what the outcome is?)... and yet you continue to dance around that point. Could you answer that question which has been posed numerous times by myself and @[I][B][U][URL="http://www.enworld.org/forum/member.php?u=6688277"]Sadras[/URL][/U][/B][/I] instead of arguing against something neither of us have claimed? Mainly that unilateral decision making on the part of the DM/GM is the [B]EXACT[/B] same as setting a DC. EDIT: The point mostly being that when you give the DM the ability to determine DC's using his own judgement (which both 4e and Traveler do, not sure about BW) you are in fact, for all intents and purposes, giving him the power to decide unilaterally whether something is possible or not (though the DM/GM doesn't necessarily have to invoke said power)... the difference as I see it being one is justified through manipulation/granularity of mechanics vs outright denial/acceptance (and even this gets a little shaky with stuff like say yes). Note: We are not speaking to how you in particular run a game...we are speaking to what the rules of said game allow. You keep making this point about 4e but if I assume as has been argued by many of it's proponents that we use the challenge to set DC's and the DM has unilateral control over what challenges are presented to the players... how do the mechanics of 4e not allow for the situation posted above (mainly an impossible DC or a DC so trivially easy you can;t help but pass)? [/QUOTE]
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